Apple is announcing new MacBooks, new iPhones and its next generation OS, Snow Leopard today but during its Keynote at WWDC they dug hard at Microsoft.Bertrand Serlet, Senior Vice President of Software Engineering at Apple, took the stage and began digging at Vista saying "what a big hole Microsoft has dug," and adding that "they're trying to get out of it with Windows 7." He carried on following up with an attack of Windows 7 saying it has "even more complexity" than Vista because it's just based on the "same old tech as Vista."
Apple is notorious for attacking Windows based PCs in its Get A Mac adverts.
Thanks to Engadget for the following picture:
My thoughts exactly.. Apple is scared that their overpriced fancy looking junk might get some competition in terms of image
Lies! Apple always said truth, ALWAYS! They wouldn't lie. Oh, wait...
Windows 7 is what DOS 1.0 should have been. Makes pretty much same sense.
...yeah you can buy a pc for half the price of mac, but the software its not taking any advantage of the hardware or at least not in its full capacity...
What a BS statement. Do you have anything to backup that BS? I would like a source on that.
Couldn't have been said any better.
Funny how Apple and the fanboys always attack MS instead of doing a like-for-like comparison.
Nevertheless Win 7 is almost out and I've been using the RC for a month or two now and it rocks! SO much faster than Vista, XP, or anything Apple has out.
Apple is running scared now!
I guess that Windows
Vista7 ad would change peoples minds to convince them to stay Mac.Look up Simon360 on the forums, he is a Mac user and a developer for Neowin, but he wrote an excellent article on how Windows 7 is making him change mind about the operating system he uses.
I wait to see the sales numbers and the reply from Apple. Hopefully after October these stupid commercials will stop.
how? In terms of image, Vista and Win7 are almost exactly the same
+1
Apple aint even on the same level as PC's in general because PC are THE STANDARD
I think they're crapping their pants because Microsoft is not only going to release an OS that has received nothing but praise and Microsoft has made some very compelling arguments about the strengths of being "PC".
Vista, even before release was being bashed, hard. 7, even in this pre-release state has already been heralded as the best thing since sliced bread.
How are these images similar?
Well.. I'd be more convinced of that if this was somehow extraordinary for Apple to do, but the thing is that it's everyday business to bash Windows.
lol, true.
Nicely put. As a side note, I had no more problems with Vista that I wouldn't have had with any OS.
Nicely put. As a side note, I had no more problems with Vista that I wouldn't have had with any OS.
...yeah you can buy a pc for half the price of mac, but the software its not taking any advantage of the hardware or at least not in its full capacity...
What a BS statement. Do you have anything to backup that BS? I would like a source on that.
Didn't you know that only OS X takes full advantage of your 64-bit CPU... oh wait...
They should be. Windows 7 will be awesome. Apple has only 6.6% of the PC market, you would think they would have more than that with all the press and hype every blog and news outlet gives them.
...yeah you can buy a pc for half the price of mac, but the software its not taking any advantage of the hardware or at least not in its full capacity...
What a BS statement. Do you have anything to backup that BS? I would like a source on that.
Agreed!
Apple, cheap digs. Somebody is very scared...
Oh well, im sure we shall she who comes out top.
LIAR!!! Another insecure MAC BOY. What are you, Apple's Lawyer?
I guess that Windows
Vista7 ad would change peoples minds to convince them to stay Mac.Look up Simon360 on the forums, he is a Mac user and a developer for Neowin, but he wrote an excellent article on how Windows 7 is making him change mind about the operating system he uses.
I wait to see the sales numbers and the reply from Apple. Hopefully after October these stupid commercials will stop.
+1
That's how much windows 7 should cost.
my thoughts too. i have a desktop pc and a unibody macbook and a total upgrade cost of less than £100 would be ideal...
+1 on it too! Or at least offer some family package like buy 3 get 1 free or some sort of discounts.
They do? Last time I checked windows 2000 was NT 5.0... XP... 5.1... that's a point upgrade... they charged for it.
It becomes even more ridiculous when your using the kernel version as the unit of measure since your ignoring the fact that Windows or most other OS are shipping with a hell of a lot more than just a kernel.
Hahaha... you wish... You a couple weeks ago, everyone was still scared Microsoft was going to go overboard with the W7 pricing, after they announce the price everyone here cheered.
in the other case, Apple couldn't charge so much for the update since they already said it was minor upgrades preparing for the big one after it. $29 it's the correct price and OSes shouldn't go above $99 EVER, no matter how professional or basic they are, they already get tons of money by selling it to billions of people and from pc manufacturers and Apple forces you to buy their own brand.
OSes should be never be free, but never be expensive.
OSes should be never be free...
Just curious, but what is wrong with giving away an OS for free?
All Service Packs were free. And SP2 for XP was a huge step ahead, adding a lot of new functionality from 5.2.
And Windows service packs rewrite the OS to be 64bit with plethora of extra features do they? No. I am a happy Windows / OS X / Linux user and I am tired of seeing the same snipes about these 10.X updates being service packs. Quite childish in most respects.
Windows 7 is pretty much the same as Snow Leopard just for Windows. It includes some UI Tweaks (as does Snow Leopard) and re-writes many parts of the operating system to make it faster and more responsive (as does Snow Leopard). So if you consider Snow Leopard a Service Pack then you need to also consider Windows 7 as such.
I personally do not see either of them as glorified service packs they are standalone operating systems.
Actually, ignorance... Apple marketing has even messed with your understanding.
OS X is NOT A 64bit OS, even with the 10.x updates. this is why the 'paid' upgrades are laughed at from the OSS and Windows worlds, especially when the list 300 'features' for an upgrade that are less than the 'features' added with ANY Windows SP over the past 10 years.
OS X has not had any major or even 'moderate' kernel changes or architectural changes. Adding 'applications' and 'security' fixes to an OS
does not make a 'real' upgrade.
Even in the Vista vs Win7 debate, there are more architectural changes and updates to the core NT OS from Vista to Win7 than there is from OS X 10.0 to 10.6.
Reread that, there is more architectural (not just fixes or peformance enhancements) changes going for Vista to Win7 than there is from OS X 10.0 to 10.6.
(Yes I can list them, starting with kernel level event services, kernel message model changes, memory model changes and even architectural driver model changes in the WDDM and adding a new reduced latecy model to the sound system that rivals professional audio equipment.)
I don't care if Apple wants to call Win7, Vista revamped, as this is not a knock, as Vista added a lot of new architecture and technology and Win7 builds on that and moves forward with even more advances while taking advantage of the good things Vista brought to the computing market.
Vista isn't a bad OS, and introduced some revolutionary technologies that people are 'just now' starting to figure out how important they are. Take even the new video model the WDDM (Where drivers sucked at launch) - it has proven that it is faster than the XPDM as the drivers have matured from ATI and NVidia and it allows for lots of features and tricks that no other OS can currently do. (Like the Hybrid features, Vista can dynamically flip video drivers and hybrid modes on the fly, something OS X has to reboot the GUI to do with a user log off.)
OS X is NOT A 64bit OS, even with the 10.x updates. this is why the 'paid' upgrades are laughed at from the OSS and Windows worlds, especially when the list 300 'features' for an upgrade that are less than the 'features' added with ANY Windows SP over the past 10 years.
OS X has not had any major or even 'moderate' kernel changes or architectural changes. Adding 'applications' and 'security' fixes to an OS
does not make a 'real' upgrade.
Even in the Vista vs Win7 debate, there are more architectural changes and updates to the core NT OS from Vista to Win7 than there is from OS X 10.0 to 10.6.
Reread that, there is more architectural (not just fixes or peformance enhancements) changes going for Vista to Win7 than there is from OS X 10.0 to 10.6.
(Yes I can list them, starting with kernel level event services, kernel message model changes, memory model changes and even architectural driver model changes in the WDDM and adding a new reduced latecy model to the sound system that rivals professional audio equipment.)
I don't care if Apple wants to call Win7, Vista revamped, as this is not a knock, as Vista added a lot of new architecture and technology and Win7 builds on that and moves forward with even more advances while taking advantage of the good things Vista brought to the computing market.
Vista isn't a bad OS, and introduced some revolutionary technologies that people are 'just now' starting to figure out how important they are. Take even the new video model the WDDM (Where drivers sucked at launch) - it has proven that it is faster than the XPDM as the drivers have matured from ATI and NVidia and it allows for lots of features and tricks that no other OS can currently do. (Like the Hybrid features, Vista can dynamically flip video drivers and hybrid modes on the fly, something OS X has to reboot the GUI to do with a user log off.)
Nor is Windows Vista/7 a 64bit OS. I am not going to turn this into a disection of updated components but needless to say the 10.6 update is an overhaul of 10.5 to the extent that it is more than a service pack. At the end of the day Vista and windows 7 are still based on NT kernel and we can be pedantic and say that they are just improvements on an already existing kernel adding what was / is needed to catch up or rival the competition. A lot of what was added in terms of the video driver model and security was to bring windows up to date for the future, in terms of the way in which the system uses the graphics card to spawn Windows etc, OS X was already way ahead and has needed very little to keep it inline with advancements offered by other operating systems. The age old addage of if it aint broke don't fix it springs to mind. I don't really want to turn this comments system into a debate, if you wanna PM me feel free or maybe start a thread and we can all pitch in our 2 cents worth
We each value different features and updates differently than others and there has to be a stark point about price. The updates for OS X have been at significantly less cost to the consumer than Windows upgrades.
Vista at launch was a terrible OS and that was, in my opinion, squarely down to the rushed job at the end in order to get the code finished and out of the door. I saw the bug reports being ignored and I saw the backlash. Its nice to see that's not the case with 7 which is going to be a great release.
Big surprise to me: Hardware cuts across the board of all MacBooks. Many by -$300!
I mean, it's NOT news that they can cut costs on their OS, since it's hardware financed. But this...
So are OS X service packs? 10.5.7 was free, and so was .6...
Show me the last "service pack" that cut down the Windows Vista post-install size by several GB due to more optimized code.
"hardware financed", very well-said!!!
Show me the last "service pack" that cut down the Windows Vista post-install size by several GB due to more optimized code.
Windows vista sp2 did. Search on google if you don't believe me. Many users reported upto 40gb being freed. Granted the free space was made when sp2 cleaned out the old updates/installers, but i wouldn't be surprised if snow leopard was doing the same.
I hate to break it to you as I type this from Vista 64...ahem
MS offers BOTH 32 and 64 bit native of Vista and 7.
Show me the last "service pack" that cut down the Windows Vista post-install size by several GB due to more optimized code.
Most of that space was freed up by ditching PowerPC binaries
Enhanced Firewall
WI-FI support
Bluetooth support
IE 6 popup blocker
DEP
Windows Security Centre
Anyway, bit hard to compare point releases between the two since they differ quite a lot.
I hate to break it to you as I type this from Vista 64...ahem
MS offers BOTH 32 and 64 bit native of Vista and 7.
Hate to break it to you but it is not a true 64bit OS, I am typing this on Vista 64bit and the kernel is not a native 64bit kernel. It is 32bit with 64bit extensions.
Anyway, bit hard to compare point releases between the two since they differ quite a lot.
I fully understand that... what I don't understand is your defensive comment... the point felease of 10.5 to 10.6 overhauls the OS so nearly every native system app and panel is 64bit. My point was no Windows service pack has come along and updated everything to be 64bit, therefore this 10.6 point update is not a service pack. It is a significant update.
I hate to break it to you as I type this from Vista 64...ahem
MS offers BOTH 32 and 64 bit native of Vista and 7.
Hate to break it to you but it is not a true 64bit OS, I am typing this on Vista 64bit and the kernel is not a native 64bit kernel. It is 32bit with 64bit extensions.
You seem to be getting confused, Windows Vista and Windows 7 have a native 64 bit version, its just that it's on separate media and not on the same disk.
OSX has a 32 bit kernel with 64 bit extensions.
Show me the last "service pack" that cut down the Windows Vista post-install size by several GB due to more optimized code.
Let's clarify this. They're cutting down on 6GB of code because they are stopping support for a platform that is only 2.5 years old. If MS did that, imagine the uproar over it.
Actually quite the opposite. The kernel is spending all its time in long mode.
All code executing at that level in an NT x64 operating system MUST be 64-bit. The only IA32 code you can have must live in userland, operating under the heel of WOW64.
Snow Leopard will only cost $29.
Last edited by MGS3_GrayFox on 08 Jun 2009 - 18:07
^^ ROFL! How true!
how?
The Mac sales seem to survive the recession, and iPhone store / device usage is skyrocketing.
Snow Leopard Upgrade will only cost $29.
There, fixed it for you.
Apple seem to forget that OSX doesn't support old applications. Win 7 works with legacy stuff right? Tsk tsk.
Don't worry Windows boys, it was said at an in-house Apple get-together so it's nothing to get all sweaty about.
Apple seem to forget that OSX doesn't support old applications. Win 7 works with legacy stuff right? Tsk tsk.
Don't worry Windows boys, it was said at an in-house Apple get-together so it's nothing to get all sweaty about.
XP Mode works seamlessly, and on most systems bought in the past 3 years. It also comes with its own license for XP, so the user does not have to "find a copy".
Well then it's time to get with the program. You can download the Virtual XP environment with a working copy of XP without any XP key. No muss, no fuss.
It just works.
Last I read from Microsoft Windows Virtual PC site was that Windows 7 Ultimate comes with a XP license for XP mode.
XP is included, no need to look for it.
Which are most processors made in the last couple of years.
Not always. But often. Say 9 out of 10.
Vista ditched native support for 16bit executables in its CMD so old DOS games are a goner unless you use 3rd party DOS emulators.
XP Mode in Win7 has a catch - it doesn't support Direct3D stuffs, which makes sense since it's just putting an app in a virtual pc onto the desktop.
To me, who cares about compatibility for things that are 10+ years old. Let's move on~
So, wait ... do you want compatibility or not?
Or are you expecting old programs to magically work in newer OSes without any sort of emulation/virtualization?
Get your arguments straight.
Vista ditched native support for 16bit executables in its CMD so old DOS games are a goner unless you use 3rd party DOS emulators.
Not entirely, only Vista 64 I think. Admittedly still a pain in the backside trying to run old games until I discovered DosBox. And that thing even has a prot for my Nokia mobile
To me, who cares about compatibility for things that are 10+ years old. Let's move on~
Probably not...considering Snow Leopard won't even support PowerPC hardware anymore.
Also, Businesses care about things that can be 10+ years old, and here's a hint...they're the biggest slice of the pie ;-)
There are numerous numerous legacy business systems out there that just work, and suggesting that they should be disrupted to upgrade them leaves your manager with a shocked face as they tell you how absurd that touching something that "just works" is.
I'm completely sure that they don't.
then they tout OS X Snow Leopard is a total refinement of OS X Leopard...
Is this a case of the pot calling the kettle black??? Or am I missing something here...
The people in charge of Apple seriously need to grow up, it's like being in a primary school playground.
Dont forget that OSX includes Photoshop.....
Last edited by techbeck on 08 Jun 2009 - 18:12
then they tout OS X Snow Leopard is a total refinement of OS X Leopard...
Is this a case of the pot calling the kettle black??? Or am I missing something here...
The people in charge of Apple seriously need to grow up, it's like being in a primary school playground.
Apple is for kids, or adults who are kids at heart. Period.
"I'm cooler than you" *In na na na na na na voice*
then they tout OS X Snow Leopard is a total refinement of OS X Leopard...
Is this a case of the pot calling the kettle black??? Or am I missing something here...
The people in charge of Apple seriously need to grow up, it's like being in a primary school playground.
OS X Leopard had much better reception than Windows Vista did. Apple is saying that OS X Snow Leopard is a refined OS X Leopard. Apple is also saying that Windows 7 is nothing more than a re-branded Windows Vista (which did not get good reception). Its all a big PR bash. Marketers learned their primary skills on school playgrounds.
And obviously Apple is VERY uninformed because Win7 is not a re-branded copy of Vista. Lots of changes and improvements in Win7.
Who are you trying to fool with this statement??
lol
Sorry, i forgot the [sarcasm] code....
Goldman from CNBC stated a month or so ago that Macs include Photoshop for free...obviously Goldman is an idiot and I was just being sarcastic...
By who? The three people that used it? Leopard was just as big as a fail and it wasn't compatible with old programs or pre-existing networks.
OS X Leopard had a terrible reception, that's why barely anyone is using Mac's and everyone's using Windows!
OS X Leopard had a terrible reception, that's why barely anyone is using Mac's and everyone's using Windows!
Leopard is the reason hardly anyone uses a Mac? What planet have you been on.
The Mac user base has trebled in the last two years... whilst the number of Windows users has declined. So troll again please
OS X Leopard had a terrible reception, that's why barely anyone is using Mac's and everyone's using Windows!
Leopard is the reason hardly anyone uses a Mac? What planet have you been on.
The Mac user base has trebled in the last two years... whilst the number of Windows users has declined. So troll again please
Are you drunk? The number of Windows users has NOT GONE DOWN.
If you are talking about the % of users, there is some change, but when you have over a billiion users of Windows and a few 10s of millions of Mac users, these %s don't even make Microsoft blink an eye...
The people in charge of Apple seriously need to grow up, it's like being in a primary school playground.
Precisely my thoughts. Both releases are pretty much adding polish to their predecessors, so I'm not getting their bashing here.
And it's the same guy doing the bashing too. First with Vista, now with 7.
it was a joke lol. some guy like 2 months ago claimed macs come with photoshop standard.
Source?
Try again.
he has learned such lie from apple
Try again.
I am tired so maybe I should rephrase what I mean.
http://www.geek.com/articles/news/windows-...ove-up-2009062/
So roughly 10% now compared with Apples share of around 5% at the beginning of 2006. Comparatively speaking Apple have doubled their market share over 2 years and yes whilst Microsoft might not care at the moment they would be foolish not to take notice of the gaining momentum from Apple.
My point was really to show the comment about Leopard being so poor it put people off buying a Mac was a load of FUD. Apple aren't going to steal over Microsoft users in my lifetime or if ever to be frank.
Where does it say that? I just re read it and it clearly differentiates Mac and Windows as operating systems in those stats.
The latest mobile phone browsing stats puts the iPhone/Touch at around 60% in terms of mobile market share.
This is one of the main reasons I am getting rid of my iPod and will never own another Apple product again. Apple cannot do business without slamming the competition and using immature marketing tactics.
And calling 7 the same tech as Vista...haha. Its improved over vista. Yea, its based off of Vista but so is the crap Snow leopard based of of leopard.
Its not making a statement. I dont like their advertising techniques and dont like their over priced crap. I can get somethings else MUCH cheaper with a TON more features.
And I am not out to be cool so curve your sarcasm. I buy things for functionality...not because it looks pretty.
if you don't like the way a company is doing business then why would you continue to support them? There are other/better products out there. techbeck FTW
Inferior? Wow, with that statement its obvious you dont know what you are talking about so I have no more comments for you.
LTD, is that you?
Nah. I just like arguing. I think the new updates from this WWDC were epically boring, personally.
FM Radio: Radio sucks; WiFi: My iPod has that; Marketplace: I don't buy music online; Radio Tagging: Radio sucks; Channels: Wat; Social: How is that a feaure?; Also: Appstore. pwnth
If you hate the company, due to them having bad business practice, why would you support them when there are alternatives which are better and cheaper?
hahaha
Yea, why Google's app store is ALL FREE AND OPEN SOURCE. Why I am getting hte G2 when it is released.
That makes you LTD v2
Nothing really new... I was hoping Apple would save something to the last for iPhone 3Gs but apparently they didn't have any more things up their sleeves. -.-
how is disliking their marketing tactics judging them by their products?
(that's why I'm not a great fan of Apple or Opera, despite Opera has one of the best web rendering engines, apparently.) It's a matter of "ethics"
Last edited by smooth_criminal1990 on 08 Jun 2009 - 23:02
The only way Apple knows how to advertise.
You can't sue Apple. They always speak the truth. And if they don't they make it the truth. They're like Chuck Norris.
MS would if they could, but it's clever marketing just on the right side.
The thing is that, yes, Windows 7 *IS* still building on the same DLL and registry makeup, and that's all Apple was saying. They can't sue for this. It's true. It's silly, yes. But it's as true as the sun shining every day.
The thing is that, yes, Windows 7 *IS* still building on the same DLL and registry makeup, and that's all Apple was saying. They can't sue for this. It's true. It's silly, yes. But it's as true as the sun shining every day.
And Apple is building on an OS they didn't even lay the groundwork for in the first place and which is from the 70's. Go figure. In other words, who are they trying to fool.
The thing is that, yes, Windows 7 *IS* still building on the same DLL and registry makeup, and that's all Apple was saying. They can't sue for this. It's true. It's silly, yes. But it's as true as the sun shining every day.
What they didn't say is that their SnowLeopard is also built on-top the old Darwin.
Best. Analogy. EVARR
Whatever. They lose integrity when doing that. Just show us why YOUR product is good.
...and by the way, my shoes are better than yours. Na na na na na naaa!
Marketing is telling the consumers about their products...not bashing the competition and trying to find any way to discredit it. The PC vs Mac ads tell NOTHING about OSX and what it can or cannot do. Pathetic...and even more Pathetic that people fall for these kind of tactics and believe everything without finding out for themselves.
Also, Apple is basically *proving* it's NOT a software company (which is why it charges diddly for OS 10.6, compared to 10.5). It's about not just marketing, but *image*. It wants to still look like David, competing against the Goliath that is Microsoft. Never mind that it has easily the most restrictive EULA for any operating system outside of UnixWare.
Image and marketing.
if you watched the apple adds on tv you'd pretty much know NOTHING about their products, just what they think is wrong with whoever they are trying to compete against.
Oh it's always pathetic pathetic pathetic, it's all about the end-product. Only petty tossers weigh up the pros and cons of the companies business strategies before even viewing the product they have to offer.
Again wow...you didnt read what I said BEFORE you commented.
I said its pathetic people fall for the negative adverts before finding out for themselves. In simple language, for you to understand, this means looking in to the products, evaluating them, and then making a decision on what you want.
Get it? Got it? If not...oh well...moving on.
I think this guy is a troll, his comments scream it everytime he posts, just ignore him.
Think of it this way, if there was one popular product, but the profits of it went to the Taliban, would you buy the product? If so then I think you need to sort your morals out. (Yes i'm comparing Apple to the Taliban, but I think this guy needs an extreme example to understand the simple reasoning)
sooooo...how the hell DO you reckon we should weigh up the "pros and cons" of companies' business strategies nao?
regardless, all companies do whatever they can if they think it will make them more money, even if it does divide opinion in the mean time. not long ago microsoft were the ones under the kosh for monopolising the software market through abusing their power (i.e. their ridiculous amount of money).
it's nothing new, and nothing to get heated about.
Windows Vista Security Flaws: 5%
Windows is 3x more secure than Macs.
Windows Vista Security Flaws: 5%
Windows is 3x more secure than Macs.
With that statement, my old dusty DOS machine is 2^n times more secure than either modern OS, simply because it can't do networking.
I really laugh out loud at my work place!!! Hilarious!
Windows Vista Security Flaws: 5%
Windows is 3x more secure than Macs.
With that statement, my old dusty DOS machine is 2^n times more secure than either modern OS, simply because it can't do networking.
It's TRUE
Windows 7 for the win! WOOT!
Oh please, Apple steals from MS and MS steals from Apple. Companies do this all this time. Get over it.
And you want innovation? How about Natal from MS...
Attention: Your cover has been blown...I repeat...your cover has been blown.
*troll alert ! troll alert!*
how is something STEALING when you BUY it? Doesn't something in that sentence tell you something?
Besides:
GUI - Apple bought it up from Xerox
Coverflow - Apple bought it
Multitouch - Apple bought it
I know the Apple fanboy collective mind wants you to believe otherwise but it's just simply the truth.
Last edited by k7of9 on 08 Jun 2009 - 18:47
And you want innovation? How about Natal from MS...
Yeah agreed, Microsoft are saints! Let's all hail the great Microsoft.
And you want innovation? How about Natal from MS...
Yeah agreed, Microsoft are saints! Let's all hail the great Microsoft.
Never said MS was a saint...again for you to understand...I said MS steals from Apple and vise versa...its common practice. And again, i NEVER EVER SAID MS WAS A SAINT.
GUI - Apple bought it up from Xerox
Coverflow - Apple bought it
Multitouch - Apple bought it
I know the Apple fanboy collective mind wants you to believe otherwise but it's just simply the truth.
Apple fanboy collective? How dramatic! Look, what gets people so polarized is when people make sweeping, ignorant statements about these companies. Apple and Microsoft are both innovative in their own ways, but lt's give credit where it's due: Apple is currently a master at designing user-friendly GUIs. Their OS has a reputation for being very easy to use (which doesn't necessarily mean much, but it's a fact) and they revolutionized the smartphone industry with their first release. Many other companies could learn from them, and at the very least, should try to repeat those types of successes. Regardless of whether you have a Microsoft or Apple logo under your pillow, surely you'd recognize that we all benefit from competition over that aspect.
And you want innovation? How about Natal from MS...
Natal was the product of another company and MS bought that company. Yeah, great innovation.
Funny thing is I didn't make any statement about any company, let alone an arrogant one. I was merely commenting on an ignorant statement by a user about a company.
A whole lot of talk about something I didn't even mention anything about. I never said Apple doesn't innovate or doesn't deserve credit. So no idea what you are actually referring to. But now that we're on the subject, they get too much credit. There are so many misconceptions about Apple being considered pioneers and great innovators while they just buy technologies from other companies (just like MS, which is what my original statement adressed). And when they do often times the original innovator gets called the imitator. So many fanboys believe Apple invented multitouch, or the GUI for example. And when you tell them what the truth actually is they always find a way to repress that and twist things around. And yes, the Apple fanboy collective was overly dramatic. Intentionally, I thought it was pretty obvious.
What makes you think they don't? Then they are either ridiculed (MS's Zune, which is a fine product and in ways superior to the iPod) or they get called copycats, regardless of whether it is justified.
What makes you think I have either one?
Neither company steals from the other. Back when Apple tried to sue Microsoft for "look and feel" violations the courts said no and a cross licensing deal was stuck between the two companies.
So, when others claim that Microsoft steals from Apple or that Redmond is starting their photocopiers, it makes me feel sorry for those that don't know any better.
And you want innovation? How about Natal from MS...
Natal was the product of another company and MS bought that company. Yeah, great innovation.
Without MS it wouldnt of been a reality...so yea, innovative
Exactly, who cares about who originates this idea if they can't do it right. All I care about is whether or whoever that can deliver the ideas right to products that we buy.
if they buy the competition, how are they stealing anything??
*troll alert ! troll alert!*
don't feed it! I know its tempting, but you're damned if you do and damned if you don't
We will see how the media embraces Windows 7, which will dictate the trend for a lot of people, just like Vista media coverage did. I still don't get why it got so bad coverage, but anyways..
Keep being stuck in stereotypes while Windows 7 is getting great reviews Apple, it will serve you right in the long run...
They are basically bashing MS for refining building on Vista while Snow Leopard is just that... an evolution of an already established OS. How is that different Apple?
You know, OSX is just not for me. But aside from that I would never switch to a Mac for the sole reason of not wanting to be associated with this type of attitude by Apple and it's fanboys.
Funny how this became a new feature in Snow Leopard. Windows 7 Aero Peek much?
The new Quicktime player mimics it perfectly.
Just wanted to point out that Aero Peek is not the only thing Apple peeked at ;-)
What a clever company....
Mac users are so victims...
If all Snow Leopard was was security updates and bug fixes, then yeah it should be free. As it is, somebody has to pay for the development of all the new features.
I feel sorry for them, I hope they don't give up, good days will come, sun will shine again.
Now that they discovered 64bit, they Rock, MAN, you feel me ?
WWDC 2009: Time for a reality check
http://img.imagedash.com/or37.png
http://img.imagedash.com/or37.png
+1 LOL awesome!
You're right...I don't get it either. I mean, if you've been using OSX since Jaguar you would have bought at least 3 Macbooks by now...making the price more like $6,029 for Snow Leopard.
"Buy a Mac, they can finally run Windows!"
"Windows sucks... but Macs can still run it so switch anyway! Please!"
"Buy a Mac, they can finally run Windows!"
"Windows sucks... but Macs can still run it so switch anyway! Please!"
I love this, awesome.
I remember this to
source: apple.com
I'm 18, I'm human being .... I'm PC
Why... why incite the fanboyism.
Sigh.
Why... why incite the fanboyism.
Sigh.
Because it's news. News doesn't have to be pleasing.
C'mon Apple, stop being scared of evolution. You're not the only ones who can do it.
This must be some other Windows 2000 that you're talking about.
Windows 2000 was wildly successful in business.
Heck, I still manage computers that use it.
Windows 2000 was wildly successful in business.
Heck, I still manage computers that use it.
Nope, we're talking evolution here. Win2k introduced new things that went into XP. More businesses adopted XP than Win2k; that's a fact. Same thing with Vista. Vista introduced new things that are getting fed over to Win 7. My whole point was about evolution, not about adoption. I can tell you that many businesses were afraid to move to 2000 while using NT 4.
Time between Vista and 7: 3 years
Time between Leopard and SL: 2 Years
Difference: 33%
Windows 7: $50 (Upgrade)
Snow Leopard: $30 (Upgrade)
Difference in price: 40%
While Windows 7 may be priced 7% higher than the difference in time. In my opinion, more has changed from Vista to 7 than in Leopard to Snow Leopard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Features_new_to_Windows_7
READ.
(Nice geek fight you have here, Tom. Thanks for letting me participate. ;-))
Interesting, all the companies had lots of different types of releases at E3, and theres already 4 posts. Maybe Neowin is becoming a Mac paradise.
E3 was covered by many more outlets in more depth than Neowin, and it's primarily about gaming.
I don't know if you noticed, but this is primarily a tech website. It has gaming news, but it's not a gaming website.
Hardly a Mac paradise with all of the anti-Apple gestapo around.
Ooh, a Nazi comparison, how original.
An accurate one, given the opportunity, I am sure.
For Window User it's considered a "Service Pack" because of the minor enchancement.
It's just low and pitiful..
Vista has sold more than Leopard. Which one is the failure?
Anyway, I think the changes in Snow Leopard are good, and I'll be buying my $29 copy when it hits the shelves, and will also be buying some version of Windows 7 (probably Professional) when it debuts in October. Because, you know, both are damn fine operating systems.
And let me say this - although I've switched to Mac OS X as my primary OS in recent months, I cannot stand the way Apple goes after Microsoft. Promoting your company's products is fine, but with Apple, it crosses the line into childish, elitist behavior, and it makes them look very insecure and small. If your product is as good as you say it is, it should be able to stand on its own merits without the constant potshots at the competition.
But i'm with you 100% on the comment about Apple slating Microsoft. I've said it repeatedly over the last few years, normally in reference to their stupid stupid Mac vs PC adverts and of course now again in reference to them wheeling out Bertrand Serlet...
I want them to advertise / sell their products on what make them great. Every time they pick lumps out of Microsoft they're either setting themselves up for taking heat when THEY make a mistake (as Apple sometimes does!) or just getting the backs up of all the people who adore Microsoft products. Microsoft have their devoted fan-base much as Apple does..
Maybe it's a social experiment by Apple to try and measure the sheer amount of wasted energy / time people spend bickering about Mac vs PC on the internet. I bet it's a staggering amount...
Never had a problem with Vista myself...so dont see what the problem is.
This is where the fanboy logic fails. Windows 7 is being built off Vista which supposedly sucked, yet 7 itself is supposedly awesome. Some of you are just plain morons.
How does PC bash Mac other than quoting price differences?
But that is not MS bashing Apple. Just comments people make. And say that it is expensive or only has 2gb of RAM is not bashing. There is a BIG difference from what MS is doing compared to Apple.
Also, it does not change the fact that I could point up at WWDC, say "Windows blows" and it would be as bad as it is right now. It's not because I said it and I am not linked to Apple in any manner that it makes things better. It's what they chose to say to the public, period.
MS bashes Apple, Apple bashes MS. They are competitors, they will always do it.
Also, it does not change the fact that I could point up at WWDC, say "Windows blows" and it would be as bad as it is right now. It's not because I said it and I am not linked to Apple in any manner that it makes things better. It's what they chose to say to the public, period.
MS bashes Apple, Apple bashes MS. They are competitors, they will always do it.
Look back and notice that MS never said anything about Apple or "bashed them" until Apple released their ads. But again, Ms is not really bashing Apple. Did MS mention apple at all during their event?...no...
Hmmm....
Wait, Apple is all about prosthetics? What are we talking here, arms, legs?
oh my god that guy is annoying as hell! how close minded is he ?!
Notice the low 1.5 star rating that guy has for his video too, over 1600 votes. I've seen that guys other biased videos that twist the truth around, he is pathetic.
If you did that every time Apple or MS bashed each other, you'd write like 10 new article every day just for that. Ridiculous...
Id say its working so far...
in any case, it's a bit ironic that apple is bashing for "same tech" while they just put the word "snow" in front of their new upcoming OS.
Incremental upgrade? Apple's product naming strategy has nothing to do with the difference from one product to the next. OS X 10.6 is not an incremental upgrade. Less of an upgrade, perhaps, but certainly worth more credit than what you give it. To the end-user it may seem as such, but the operating system has been optimized from the ground up, including Finder. That would be as if Microsoft completely rewrote Explorer.
In reality, Apple's comment that Windows is the "same old tech" is pretty accurate in one major aspect- the registry. The registry really does need to go, with preferences and application settings being stored on the disk individually as opposed to in a central repository. There is less chance for corruption and clutter. Basically, however, Apple is stating that Windows 7 is a rerelease of Windows Vista, which no one can argue against. It's Microsoft's opportunity to fix Vista, which is what they seem to be doing based upon the public response. Snow Leopard isn't a rerelease of Leopard, rather it's an evolution of a successful product, a product with greater market penetration than any previous Apple OS. All it takes is one look at the fact that Windows Vista has been unfavorable received, as opposed to Leopard, to see what they are getting at. To all that say Apple is scared; they aren't scared. They are doing what every other company does in this position, which is to try to favorably show your own product as opposed to the competition's.
Apparently the Apple operating system has no features worth talking about.
If Microsoft does come out with the lower upgrade prices, it will definitely improve their sales and popularity.
and the whole "omg its built on vista so it MUST be crap!"
these statements are plain stupid.. has anyone heard of PROGRESS??
what do they expect MS to do, go back to win2k/xp and build on that instead? I love those 2 OS' but things dont get anywhere by sticking to the same thing that works all the time..
I hated vista, but give MS some credit, they're not clinging to it anymore, they're moving on to bring us bigger and better things in 7.
Unfortunately "omg apple is way more awesome than MS" or vice versa trolling will always continue to happen on articles like this.. i find it annoying but maybe thats just me..
All they have been doing for the past few years is make their customers pay for glorified service packs every few months.
I never had any problems with Vista, just a tad slow....Been running Win7 since beta 7000, and now RC1, not
one issue....4 year old dell E1505, 2 gig ram. Runs like a champ.
Someone got win7 running on a pentium II, i'd like to see vista do that
(i realise its pointless to do such a thing, but the point is that windows 7 is a LOT more compatible with older PCs than vista ever was.
It gives people a lot more options!
You don't see the same kind of bare knuckle mud slinging in any other consumer product, politics being a consumer product these days :-).
Perhaps because when it comes down to it the differences between the two choices at hand are not that much.
It looks just like Leopard and o wait its the same tech as Leopard too
I'm kinda happy Vista turned out the way it did. Apple got complacent and now they see the juggernaut Bitch!!!!
they are doing what they usually do, seeing a competitor doing better, being jealous, and instead of boasting about what their products can do they start bashing others(and really, you cant bash W7..)
Also, did they forget that most of the applications in Vista x64 were, in fact, 64 bit? That OS came out in 2006.
Apple put a evident flamebait as a cheap ads campaign, they are a genius!.
Windows trolls really does not, calm down (don't know whats driving them mad, maybe their non-satisfaction with what they are defending? maybe apple is too threatening ? maybe Microsoft inability to keep up ?
maybe because they are used to afford junk (not all pcs) and believe that they had the best quality until apple came along?! and now thats too pricy for you?! guess what, thats what quality costs!.. even if they are more expensive than the standard high quality margin would be,... its worth it..
the IDEA.. is not that narrow minded to the point that you see it just the same PC components in a shiny overpriced package!! (I won't explain it.. because if you really care to know you would research that honestly yourself than just bashing!..
Macs works, entirely different that what PCs approach is. from a hardware point (as you can easily connect your harddrive to someone else's mac and boot it without installing drivers.. even if the specifications of the two systems are different or has different Peripherals or components cards!, excluding some Mac Pro third Party Expansion cards that require driver installations).. thats of-course regardless of that every piece of software or whatever are completely supported and compatible and trouble free, as if you had a game console and buying games and peripherals for it.., you are sure that games will work and won't be slow.. and its perfect for the console, and that would be it for any upcoming game that will be released for that console.. try imaging that with macs as they are consoles and its software and peripherals are like its games.. (of course excluding the ppc, and any big transition that could come up in the future)
as from an OS point of view, I cannot really compare OSX to windows. it would be unfair for both of them
bit i can say (and i've been using both from a long time) that OSX beats windows hands down when it comes to convenience!! ( there is alot to say here,.. but you can find that out yourself if you care)
also you cannot get that good feeling and sense of joy while using OSX from windows..
as for windows its has its strong points too, as for example being..duh. WINDOWS, and its wide software availability and some other business and professional usage domain strong points..
But as a blind fact, i see OSX as an innovative OS when it comes to how OSX works!..
I can't imagine how are you guys living with yourselves that easily when you are just denying apple innovation, or being innovative!
all you see that their products are garbage, pricy, etc... Don't you ever have something new to say? because I sense that the way here is just bashing.. and no valid arguments..
it looks like the classic arguments when atheists try to deny the existence of god, although they know that GOD is there!
so calm down..
AND I INVITE EVRY Mac USER TO STOP RESPONDING OR WRITING COMMENTS ON NEOWIN... because if thats the way windows trolls's gonna be, then lets leave them talking to themselves!
I don't say that all windows users here are that way though,.. so I hope i've not offended everyone!..
thanks.
WWDC 2009 Bertrand Serlet talks Snow Leopard.
-90% Refinements.
-Technologies.
-Exchange.
Copying...
-Leopard to Snow Leopard.
-WIndows Vista to Windows 7.
-Windows 7 Superbar Running Peek Preview.
-Clutter (Expose) in Snow Leopard.
-Windows 7 Build uppon Vista.
-Snow Leopard build uppon Leopard.
-Windows 7 is better than vista.
-Snow Leopard build a better Leopard.
-Fast OS installation in Windows 7.
-Fast OS installation in Snow Leopard.
-More resizeable OS space in Windows 7.
-More resizeable OS space(compressed) in Snow Leopard.
-Windows Media Player 11 & 12 full screen mode.
-Snow Leopard Quicktime X full screen mode look familiar...
-Why Snow Leopard Upgrade so cheap $29:
No many to upgrade.
No new things.
Still same as old Leopard.
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