Mum vs Windows 8 - attempting a shutdown

[duddit2]

Every single person I have shown windows 8 to, every single one of them (my son aged 12, girlfriends daughters aged 11 and 13, my mum and dad aged 63 and 67 and a few customers) have all shown similar confusion. This is to be expected as its freaking new!

I simply told them use the corners when stuck, then as they were getting used to it I'd wait with them for 10 minutes or so and once or twice just had to reiterate when I saw the cursor stuck (obviously they were stuck) "use the corners" - and that my friends was that, within ten minutes they were rocking windows 8.

[xWhiplash]

You saying that in a way that implies all parents / grandparents can't speak or don't know how to do a google search etc. Do you not have 2-5 mins to do it for them?

My father is 67, he's not a power user whatsoever, I've just upgraded his PC to Windows 8, shown him once how to shut it down etc and he's fine .... not asked me since on how to shut down or get to the start screen etc.

People really do need to give the older generation the benefit of doubt instead of using them to further their dislike of Windows 8

Sigh....Did you see I said "you expect MY parents or grandparents to do this"? I said MY meaning I know what they are capable of, and I highly doubt they are the ONLY people who would have issues. My grandparents live far away, I would rather get them Windows 7 than deal with constant questions about the changes.

I don't think anyone is expecting your parents or grandparents to do anything, well anything other than use the charm bar/settings/power/shutdown. It isn't obvious no, but its also not obvious when it was in the start menu - you just knew it was there. This charm bar method takes no time to get used to, but if your not even going to show them how to use the modern interface or even say 'use the corners' then your kind of building your own obstacles.

What? You knew the Shut Down was in the Start Menu because it has been there since Windows 95. They (parents and grandparents) have Windows XP or Windows 7 at work, and they do not keep their systems up after hours, so they use it daily.

Every single person I have shown windows 8 to, every single one of them (my son aged 12, girlfriends daughters aged 11 and 13, my mum and dad aged 63 and 67 and a few customers) have all shown similar confusion. This is to be expected as its freaking new!

I simply told them use the corners when stuck, then as they were getting used to it I'd wait with them for 10 minutes or so and once or twice just had to reiterate when I saw the cursor stuck (obviously they were stuck) "use the corners" - and that my friends was that, within ten minutes they were rocking windows 8.

Or...you know ...have them stick with Windows 7? If we all just bend over and accept ANYTHING that MS does, how does that benefit us? What would be damn horrible to request some options for the user? Guess what? When Windows 98...XP...7 were new, the people I know who are not that good at computers did not suddenly have issues. With Windows 8....and you even said this yourself....experience confusion (some have major confusions).

[Jase]

Simple, alt + f4.

[duddit2]

Sigh....Did you see I said "you expect MY parents or grandparents to do this"? I said MY meaning I know what they are capable of, and I highly doubt they are the ONLY people who would have issues. My grandparents live far away, I would rather get them Windows 7 than deal with constant questions about the changes.

What? You knew the Shut Down was in the Start Menu because it has been there since Windows 95. They (parents and grandparents) have Windows XP or Windows 7 at work, and they do not keep their systems up after hours, so they use it daily.

Or...you know ...have them stick with Windows 7? If we all just bend over and accept ANYTHING that MS does, how does that benefit us? What would be damn horrible to request some options for the user? Guess what? When Windows 98...XP...7 were new, the people I know who are not that good at computers did not suddenly have issues. With Windows 8....and you even said this yourself....experience confusion (some have major confusions).

I work in support, and hated the whole turning off XP style start menu to the 'classic' menu, I bet you were a massive fan of this ey?

Listen things change, I love windows 8 and find it helps me get stuff done quicker than 7 - the people I have shown it to and installed for them love it, I get that you don't like it and you come across as simply not liking anything changing.

So yeah stick with windows 7, and all is good...........until 10 years down the line when you face the end of its life and things have moved so far away from you its all crap.

Or move to OSx like others have been saying, because why get used to some slight changes in windows when you can move to a completely different platform and have to learn everything from scratch?

I don't mean to sound offensive, I really don't as I don't know you - its just this whole 'they changed it and I WILL NOT bend' attitude that gets me, if history tells us anything (along with current facebook trends of change - moan - groups setup - goes quiet - everyone seems ok with it) its that people are initially upset at change but change is actually necessary. In this case its necessary due to the inroads made by iOS and android, either way its here and its staying ;)

But they wree generational changes, try looking at DOS - Windows changes.

What amazes me is how different any new system is to anyone (iOS, android, Mac OSx), but they just have a go and get it, but this whole attitude to windows 8 is 'ahhh its different, noooooooooooo' - its SLIGHTLY different logically but appears to be totally different, it took 10 minutes for all I know to get it, 10 MINUTES FOR GODS SAKE!!! haha rant over ;)

[xWhiplash]

I work in support, and hated the whole turning off XP style start menu to the 'classic' menu, I bet you were a massive fan of this ey?

Listen things change, I love windows 8 and find it helps me get stuff done quicker than 7 - the people I have shown it to and installed for them love it, I get that you don't like it and you come across as simply not liking anything changing.

So yeah stick with windows 7, and all is good...........until 10 years down the line when you face the end of its life and things have moved so far away from you its all crap.

Or move to OSx like others have been saying, because why get used to some slight changes in windows when you can move to a completely different platform and have to learn everything from scratch?

I don't mean to sound offensive, I really don't as I don't know you - its just this whole 'they changed it and I WILL NOT bend' attitude that gets me, if history tells us anything (along with current facebook trends of change - moan - groups setup - goes quiet - everyone seems ok with it) its that people are initially upset at change but change is actually necessary. In this case its necessary due to the inroads made by iOS and android, either way its here and its staying ;)

But they wree generational changes, try looking at DOS - Windows changes.

What amazes me is how different any new system is to anyone (iOS, android, Mac OSx), but they just have a go and get it, but this whole attitude to windows 8 is 'ahhh its different, noooooooooooo' - its SLIGHTLY different logically but appears to be totally different, it took 10 minutes for all I know to get it, 10 MINUTES FOR GODS SAKE!!! haha rant over ;)

You misunderstand me. I have said on many occasions that I prefer Windows 8. I no longer have a Windows 7 OS installed on any of my computers. But I am not allowed to complain without being called out saying "I am TOO afraid of change"?

We are not the normal typical computer user. I cannot tell you how many times I have had to repeat myself on how to Shut Down Windows 8. People STILL look in the Start Screen for the shut down, even after I told them dozens of times on how to Shut Down in Windows 8.

[duddit2]

Oh sorry about the misunderstanding there, my bad.

it seems we're both just going off personal experience here, and in mine people have got used to it rather quickly.

i suppose having shutdown in the user menu wouldn't harm though.

[MorganX]

I like Windows 8, a lot. I hate it's search and lack of context (right-click) options in the Modern UI. Having to go to top or bottom of screen for context action is totally inferior to in place context menu. I hate the Music App. I hate the lack of true sync between WP8, Surface, and W8 Desktop.

It's irritating closing by double-clicking in upper left usually hits the app switch corner and it's so fact, I can click through a couple apps before I'm back to the desktop and decide to go to the X in the upper left, only to trigger the charms bar. Annoying. The faster your machine is, the more annoying and more likely you'll hit a hot corner when you don't want to.

I hate that share and devices charm are basically worthless (at this time) on the desktop.

But shutting down too difficult? Come on guys, seriously?

[dead.cell]

No....that is not how products work. VERY VERY UNLIKELY: If Photoshop released CS7 for the same price, and ALL it did was crop images, would that be okay? No. You said it...we BUY the software. If it does not do what we want, we will not buy it. Just because you make an operating system/video game/any program does not give you immunity to do whatever you want.

If this change made Windows 8 a MASSIVE.....MASSIVE failure, as a business they WOULD have reverted back to the old ways.

You expect my parents or grandparents to do this? THEY are the users that shut down their computers more often than us.

That's a horrible analogy and you know it. I'm not the biggest Windows 8 fan, but to argue that it's been gimped in such a way is preposterous, or even insinuated that's what I meant at all.

I also find it ridiculous that you're basically coming up here and claiming your parents and grandparents are incapable of learning. My grandmother is about to turn 68 and handles this stuff just fine, hell I got her set up using Spotify and ripping/burning CDs. I also teach 60+ age groups at work how to use this stuff on a daily basis at work, seeing as I sell computers for a living at the moment.

This thread is based on a stupid video where the guy dumps his mother on a product she knows nothing about only to laugh at her. That's my beef with all this. You don't have to like Windows 8, that's fine, I'm not the biggest fan of it either, but this argument is just weak.

[nekrosoft13]

The plain truth is that Windows 8 suffers from poor design choices.

windows 8 is design disaster

[airedwin]

People are stupid. I am certain Microsoft did tons and tons of research on this. Where is the shutdown option on an iPad or Android? You just use the button.

Most people probably leave their computers powered on in a sleep or suspended mode. I haven't shut my computer down in years.

[+Warwagon MVC]

I have this one customer who wanted both his XP machines updated to windows 8 pretty much the first week windows 8 came out. I just got off the phone with him and he was telling me about how it takes more steps to do the same thing in windows 8 than XP. This is a guy who has been using windows 8 since it launched and still doesn't like it. So I gave him start8 and told him to try it and see if he likes it. After trying out a few basic tasks he said that was really nice, a lot easier than windows 8.

[Colin McGregor]

I have this one customer who wanted both his XP machines updated to windows 8 pretty much the first week windows 8 came out. I just got off the phone with him and he was telling me about how it takes more steps to do the same thing in windows 8 than XP. This is a guy who has been using windows 8 since it launched and still doesn't like it. So I gave him start8 and told him to try it and see if he likes it. After trying out a few basic tasks he said that was really nice, a lot easier than windows 8.

So instead of taking 3 minutes of your day to teach him to use start screen you install a start menu and help him not have to learn anything. Sounds like great IT work to me

windows 8 is design disaster

So glad nekrosoft can input yet another great contribution to an anti-windows topic. Good job dude.

[Noir Angel]

True, the first thing they'd see unboxing it is the tutorial showing them how to use bring up the charms ;)

How about a tutorial on how to search? How about switching your desktop so that your files play with desktop apps rather than Metro apps?

[+Warwagon MVC]

When he f

So instead of taking 3 minutes of your day to teach him to use start screen you install a start menu and help him not have to learn anything. Sounds like great IT work to me

When I first installed windows 8 for him I took 30 mins and showed him all about windows 8. and how to do stuff. Face it, Windows 8 just makes some people want to puke in their mouth.

I know how to use windows 8 and I still like start8 better.

[Colin McGregor]

How about a tutorial on how to search? How about switching your desktop so that your files play with desktop apps rather than Metro apps?

Is it hard to search? I installed W8 on my grandmas computer and she finds everything. Sure some things don't show in Apps but she's not blind so she knew when she saw a 1 next to settings that she can click that.

Comptia should add windows 8 to the exams. Being on this site and seeing how many "IT" people have issues it would be funny to see how many actually know computers and how many just barely got through the exam.

[Noir Angel]

I'm not short sighted enough to try and browbeat people into thinking that all change is for the good. If someone doesn't like the start screen I will teach them about alternatives simply because I'm not arrogant enough to assume that their usability needs have no merit because I disagree with them.

Is it hard to search? I installed W8 on my grandmas computer and she finds everything. Sure some things don't show in Apps but she's not blind so she knew when she saw a 1 next to settings that she can click that.

Comptia should add windows 8 to the exams. Being on this site and seeing how many "IT" people have issues it would be funny to see how many actually know computers and how many just barely got through the exam.

I know how to use it, I just don't like the start screen. Is it really so hard for people like you to compute that simple fact? And to someone who doesn't understand computers, yes it could be hard to figure out as nowhere is it made obvious that you have to start typing to search.

[Colin McGregor]

I'm not short sighted enough to try and browbeat people into thinking that all change is for the good. If someone doesn't like the start screen I will teach them about alternatives simply because I'm not arrogant enough to assume that their usability needs have no merit because I disagree with them.

I know how to use it, I just don't like the start screen. Is it really so hard for people like you to compute that simple fact? And to someone who doesn't understand computers, yes it could be hard to figure out as nowhere is it made obvious that you have to start typing to search.

Not liking it is just fine. Whats even better is maybe the people that don't like it use windows 7 and refrain from making windows 8 threads and comments. Do you go into an apple store and tell everyone how you have Apple and have windows, or go into an MS store and tell everyone there that apple is better? This logic doesn't work on Neowin and the forums are full of people that would never use Win8 or hate Win8 but seem to have the time to think its cool to tell everyone. The start screen is easy to use, so is search /thread. Posting a video of an elderly woman trying without telling her how to use it is just flame bait, but that don't matter. People here make threads all the time talking about how windows 8 sucks and they get nothing. I defend windows 8 and I get a 10 day ban. So im just gonna leave the thread cause unless I say MS sucks and I love apple and android with all my being im gonna get banned again. Peace.

[Noir Angel]

Not liking it is just fine. Whats even better is maybe the people that don't like it use windows 7 and refrain from making windows 8 threads and comments. Do you go into an apple store and tell everyone how you have Apple and have windows, or go into an MS store and tell everyone there that apple is better? This logic doesn't work on Neowin and the forums are full of people that would never use Win8 or hate Win8 but seem to have the time to think its cool to tell everyone. The start screen is easy to use, so is search /thread. Posting a video of an elderly woman trying without telling her how to use it is just flame bait, but that don't matter. People here make threads all the time talking about how windows 8 sucks and they get nothing. I defend windows 8 and I get a 10 day ban. So im just gonna leave the thread cause unless I say MS sucks and I love apple and android with all my being im gonna get banned again. Peace.

Ahh so this is a "go away and don't express your opinions" thing. Last time I checked this was a forum for tech discussion, not "love everything Microsoft do or GTFO". If you can't stand people having opposing opinions to yours, maybe you'd be better off somewhere like the technet forums or somewhere that's happy to censor all dissenting opinions for you. Your subjective opinions don't equal facts, and as long as your opinions continue to be as subjective as they are then you're going to get people with different opinions. If you can't hack it go away. And if you got a warning perhaps that's a hint that you need to stop talking down to those that don't share your opinions?

[Colin McGregor]

Ahh so this is a "go away and don't express your opinions" thing. Last time I checked this was a forum for tech discussion, not "love everything Microsoft do or GTFO". If you can't stand people having opposing opinions to yours, maybe you'd be better off somewhere like the technet forums or somewhere that's happy to censor all dissenting opinions for you. Your subjective opinions don't equal facts, and as long as your opinions continue to be as subjective as they are then you're going to get people with different opinions. If you can't hack it go away. And if you got a warning perhaps that's a hint that you need to stop talking down to those that don't share your opinions?

This isn't a tech forum anymore. Show me the last tech post. Even the front page editorials are anti-windows 8. And its not a love everything MS or GTFO, its a "Lets make a anti-windows 8 thread and everyone post there like most tech sites do" kind of thing. Type Windows 8 in search and its all BS or something positive for one post that turns into BS real quick. And its not even "opposing opinions" as you put it, its people saying "oh it sucks" or "its a disease" or "I installed it for 5 minutes and that was enough time for me to become an expert, uninstall it and then tell everyone I can as many times as I can" opinions. Is it too much to ask for facts. How about I don't like the start screen because I cant do this, or I don't like windows 8 because it doesn't do this but my windows 7 does, is there a fix? or an alternative?. No its the UI people should be shot, or it sucks cause I said, or as I said above I tried it for 5 minutes then got rid of it but I learned enough in those 5 minutes to be an expert.

[Nadja]

it's so easy for Neowin trolls to be so judgemental when you're in the know!!

Windows 8 menus/context navigation has never been intuitive from the start, it also lacks refinements to customize settings for hot corners and the Charm bar - mouse sensitivity and accuracy really sucks!!

For first time newcomers to Windows 8 regardless of their age, gender or IQ (heavily discriminated here) they will always find the navigation illogical and be perplexed by the location of the basic options such as shutdown.

[Colin McGregor]

it's so easy for Neowin trolls to be so judgemental when you're in the know!!

Windows 8 menus/context navigation has never been intuitive from the start, it also lacks refinements to customize settings for hot corners and the Charm bar - mouse sensitivity and accuracy really sucks!!

For first time newcomers to Windows 8 regardless of their age, gender or IQ (heavily discriminated here) they will always find the navigation illogical and be perplexed by the location of the basic options such as shutdown.

Your right, it is difficult for newcomers. But its also not hard to learn if you're shown. This video doesn't do that. It was made to troll and to laugh at someone. Nothing more nothing less. My parents and grandparents now use windows 8 and I didn't install it and boom they were pros but once I sat them down and showed them how to pin / unpin, bring up the charm and shutdown they now use it like they would any other OS. Everyone is a noob to start, no matter what they say but its annoying when people that admit they have no intention to learn or even use Windows 8 throw "opinions" around and start flamewars without even saying why other then it sucks. Then I say don't like it don't use it and i'm the troll.

[Noir Angel]

This isn't a tech forum anymore. Show me the last tech post. Even the front page editorials are anti-windows 8. And its not a love everything MS or GTFO, its a "Lets make a anti-windows 8 thread and everyone post there like most tech sites do" kind of thing. Type Windows 8 in search and its all BS or something positive for one post that turns into BS real quick. And its not even "opposing opinions" as you put it, its people saying "oh it sucks" or "its a disease" or "I installed it for 5 minutes and that was enough time for me to become an expert, uninstall it and then tell everyone I can as many times as I can" opinions. Is it too much to ask for facts. How about I don't like the start screen because I cant do this, or I don't like windows 8 because it doesn't do this but my windows 7 does, is there a fix? or an alternative?. No its the UI people should be shot, or it sucks cause I said, or as I said above I tried it for 5 minutes then got rid of it but I learned enough in those 5 minutes to be an expert.

Oh please, you really must have selective reading syndrome if you've forgotten gems like "Anyone that compares 8 to Vista should be shot". Neowin and it's members are not obliged to cater for your desire for a Microsoft love in.

[argonite]

Windows 8 has about the same number of illogical design decisions as Windows 7. It's just that you're used to Windows 7.

Someday you'll be used to Windows 8 and then Windows 10 will come along with a 3D desktop and you'll ask "why did they hide the shutdown option within three z-axis rotations and a pan!?"

[Colin McGregor]

Oh please, you really must have selective reading syndrome if you've forgotten gems like "Anyone that compares 8 to Vista should be shot". Neowin and it's members are not obliged to cater for your desire for a Microsoft love in.

lol you quote 1 non anti-W8 thread almost an hour later and even that isn't a sensible thread. Thanks for proving my point.

[Noir Angel]

Just 1 example, clearly you must read the front page pretty infrequently and selectively if you think the attitude towards Windows 8 is negative here.