DRM is the killer feature

[0nyX]

It worked out pretty well for Ubisoft

 

http://uk.ign.com/articles/2012/09/05/ubisoft-officially-ditches-always-on-pc-drm

http://kotaku.com/5940535/ubisoft-gives-up-on-its-stupid-pc-drm

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/09/05/ubisoft-scrapping-always-on-drm-for-pc-games/

[Fourjays Veteran]

I still think there is something Microsoft has yet to reveal with regards to the DRM. Positive or negative? I don't know. I just don't get why if the DRM was there for the supposedly overly-generous reasons we currently know about, why Microsoft weren't (and still aren't) screaming about it from the rooftops. Instead they seem subdued and talk about it in fairly ambiguous terms. Getting information about it has been like pulling teeth. So I think either there is an even better aspect to it that they've yet to unveil (a real "killer feature" that they are keeping under wraps), or there is another "catch".

[George P Global Moderator]

Its been the best thing out of E3, watching people defend the hell out of DRM. Never thought we would see the day after the backlash similar DRM on the PC got.

You mean the initial backlash Steam got on the PC but then turned into a massive success?    As much as people don't want to compare it to Steam that's something MS has done itself from what I remember.   So it would seem the comparisons are valid ones.

[Dotdot]

Im still pissing myself at the notion that through all of this, were going to see the level of customer service etc that we`ve seen this generation from Ms Xbox and at the same time have even more restrictions and rules placed on the service provided.

[compl3x]

Its been the best thing out of E3, watching people on Neowin defend the hell out of DRM. Never thought we would see the day after the backlash similar DRM on the PC got.

 

 

ftfy

 

I'm not too familiar with it happening many other places.

[George P Global Moderator]

It worked out pretty well for Ubisoft

 

http://uk.ign.com/articles/2012/09/05/ubisoft-officially-ditches-always-on-pc-drm

http://kotaku.com/5940535/ubisoft-gives-up-on-its-stupid-pc-drm

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/09/05/ubisoft-scrapping-always-on-drm-for-pc-games/

It's true Ubisoft took it too far, but we're talking constant online DRM in that case.   Something like with SimCity, though if you ask EA about SimCity they'll tell you it's the best selling version of the franchise to date.  So for them, did the DRM hurt that game?  Tough to actually say because while the internet rage says one thing, the sales numbers for it say a different thing.   Makes you wonder.

 

Either way, we're not on the constant online DRM level with the Xbox One, the 24hr check for offline play, something that could be tweaked and extended.  It's just not at that level, but at the same time the requirement for it on the PC made no sense for Ubisoft to do.  You PC install is limited to one anyways, that's why we have CD keys, or if you go through a digital service it's tied to your account.  Again, there's no sharing options, something the Xbox One will have.  

[TPreston]

DRM is restrictive. My thinking would be, this is to force more people to buy games first hand. This will kill gamestop unless they go to straight first-hand sales.

 

DRM is NEVER pro consumer.

Its not that black and white DRM is the reason we have free to play tv,music etc.

 

If your paying for it fine but for free services like Xbox music its acceptable

[George P Global Moderator]

Its not that black and white DRM is the reason we have free to play tv,music etc.

 

If your paying for it fine but for free services like Xbox music its acceptable

 

It still depends though, even the pay versions of many services have DRM of some sort.    

[+Anarkii Subscriber²]

bleh DRM. The death of the gaming industry.

Leisure Suit Larry 1 did DRM right. Thats all im sayin.

[]SK[]

bleh DRM. The death of the gaming industry.

Leisure Suit Larry 1 did DRM right. Thats all im sayin.

Not if you weren't American or from that era but are 18 now...

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

ftfy

 

I'm not too familiar with it happening many other places.

 

True.

 

Gamers have short term memory issues. Blizzard tried to tell us why DRM was needed in Diablo 3, now Diablo 3 for the consoles is offline. EA tried to tell us why Sim City needs DRM, hacker cracked Sim City and it plays offline no problem. MS tells us why we need DRM..... *insert time machine*.....

[George P Global Moderator]

I like how some of you are just lumping all the DRM together into one like the same DRM scheme used by one company is the one we're going to get for everything.   I thought it was pretty clear already that we're not going to have to be connected online all the time to play every game.  Yet you guys want to bring up diablo 3 and SimCity, even though, again, those sold very well so I doubt the developer even cares.  I don't see EA changing it's stance on SimCity, have they?   And Diablo 3 for consoles is offline, yay, is it like that on the PC now to?  I honestly don't know.  

 

MS could've set the security check to be once a week and we'd still be having this same comparison I bet, even though it's not the same.

[HawkMan]

MS haven't detailed how this will work though. What we know is only one person can access a single game at the same time. But what has not been answered is can all 10 friends play different games from your library at the same time? Or once one is accessing a game, no one else can?

Actually from wha is said it may be one person playing any one game at any time OR the main owner and one other. This hasn't been fully clarified.

Also we know than a least the owner and one other can access the library. But it hasn't been clarified if more than one extra member can access the library at the same time.

Either way, 10 people, 10 family libraries....

[Nagisan]

PC games, oh yes, unless you've found some way to legally lend and resell your PC games then please do share with us how, I'd really like to know.

Last I checked it has never been illegal to resell or lend out PC games. I might be against a games EULA, but it is not illegal.

[Emn1ty]

Absolutely clueless.

Really? Doesn't seem clueless to me.

 

Last I checked it has never been illegal to resell or lend out PC games. I might be against a games EULA, but it is not illegal.

It's difficult to do now when a large number of them automatically tie to a service like Origin or Steam.

[LaP]

MS haven't detailed how this will work though. What we know is only one person can access a single game at the same time. But what has not been answered is can all 10 friends play different games from your library at the same time? Or once one is accessing a game, no one else can?

 

They did not really clearly detail who can be a family member too. They said anyone but it's almost wishful thinking. I agree with Giant Bomb staff members that some clarification would be welcome.

 

I highly doubt it's gonna be the wild west some people think it's gonna be. There gonna be limitations. If not it's gonna hurt the sales of One games and it's not what Microsoft is aiming to achieve with this DRM scheme.

[BajiRav]

 I don't think even Microsoft knows what Family sharing is about yet. :s They would've made it a bullet point at E3 otherwise. At best, you won't be able to change family members once you add them (or change once / year or for a fee etc.)

Agreed. And this is why I don't agree with it.

 

Take a look at this for example:

 

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/license

 

Publishers will have the power to restrict you from giving your disc-based game to a friend. Wouldn't you be frustrated if you can't lend a game that you don't play anymore to a good friend? "Sorry man, you can't play it on your Xbox One because Activision won't allow it."

 

Publishers also have the power to block used games, rentals, loaning on PS4. Everyone is OK with that though?

 

True.

 

Gamers have short term memory issues. Blizzard tried to tell us why DRM was needed in Diablo 3, now Diablo 3 for the consoles is offline. EA tried to tell us why Sim City needs DRM, hacker cracked Sim City and it plays offline no problem. MS tells us why we need DRM..... *insert time machine*.....

They do. Remember the untapped potential of the CELL and how it was orders of magnitudes more powerful than the Xenos? :rofl: yeah, I do.

[FiB3R]

It's a killer feature alright, if killing trust, faith, good will, loyalty, mind share and sales is a "feature".

 

Well played.

As for people that think this sharing with 10 other people is such a great idea, I think you are deluded.

 

Who are these 10 great people that you are going to want to share with?

 

Are they going to have the games you want, when you want them?

 

Or are you the one with all the games?

 

It's just as it is now, apart from being more convenient for broke cousin johnny to leech from your collection. Only now, he can only borrow it once, so that is a bonus, right? :rolleyes:

[George P Global Moderator]

Last I checked it has never been illegal to resell or lend out PC games. I might be against a games EULA, but it is not illegal.

Legal stuff aside, you can't.  I buy a disc copy of a game on the PC, I have a cd key to use.  Once I use it then it's used, as far as I know I can't reuse it.   Other games also tie into other services, you can buy a disc copy and tie it to your steam account and then, what?   Sure you can give the disc away but honestly, for the longest time now PC games have been install once and done.    There's no used PC games market for this reason.

They did not really clearly detail who can be a family member too. They said anyone but it's almost wishful thinking. I agree with Giant Bomb staff members that some clarification would be welcome.

 

I highly doubt it's gonna be the wild west some people think it's gonna be. There gonna be limitations. If not it's gonna hurt the sales of One games and it's not what Microsoft is aiming to achieve with this DRM scheme.

 

I don't think they'll limit who you can add as "family", the limit is in how many, 10, and then however they decide it can be used at any given time.  That could be you + one out of the 10 leaving the other 9 out, or it could be some other combination.  That type of limiting is fine because it does keep it in check.    I'm leaning towards the limit being you + one friend at the same time so the other 9 have to wait or can each just play one game only.   Guess we'll know soon, lots of info could be held back for BUILD on the 26th, specially the indie developer info that I expect.

[FiB3R]

There are over 33000 used PC games for sale on eBay uk at this moment in time.

[0sit0]

I would have been fine with all the DRM if the game prices were lower. I don't like "renting" games for retail price. Yes, renting is technically what you are doing because you don't own anything anymore. Call me old fashioned but that's my opinion.

[MikeChipshop Member]

Lot of boohoo about DRM.

That's the problem with the world today everyone wants everything free with no restrictions. Truth of the matter is, in order to progress new forms of management have to come in to practice so quit whining because it's happening and there's nothing you can do about it and for the sake of the industry there's nothing you should do about it.

 

I would have been fine with all the DRM if the game prices were lower. I don't like "renting" games for retail price. Yes, renting is technically what you are doing because you don't own anything anymore. Call me old fashioned but that's my opinion.

 

I know where you're coming from but nothing has changed there. You're still purchasing a right to use licence.

[BajiRav]

It's a killer feature alright, if killing trust, faith, good will, loyalty, mind share and sales is a "feature".

 

Well played.

As for people that think this sharing with 10 other people is such a great idea, I think you are deluded.

 

Who are these 10 great people that you are going to want to share with?

 

Are they going to have the games you want, when you want them?

 

Or are you the one with all the games?

 

It's just as it is now, apart from being more convenient for broke cousin johnny to leech from your collection. Only now, he can only borrow it once, so that is a bonus, right? :rolleyes:

The same great 10 people that ant-DRM folks want to lend their games or borrow from them. :p

[JustGeorge]

Of course all the positive aspects are good till they decide to change the policy and disallow game sharing. This is something you'll have to accept should you buy into this model. Once you turn over control, the noose only gets tighter over time. How long do you think it will be till publishers start seeing game sharing the same as they view renting and second hand selling?

 

Enjoy the butt-rape :)

[Jim K Global Moderator]

Lot of boohoo about DRM.

That's the problem with the world today everyone wants everything free with no restrictions. Truth of the matter is, in order to progress new forms of management have to come in to practice so quit whining because it's happening and there's nothing you can do about it and for the sake of the industry there's nothing you should do about it.

 

 

I know where you're coming from but nothing has changed there. You're still purchasing a right to use licence.

$60 bucks for a game is hardly free.  Yea, if I buy something I want to use/sell it the way I want and without it having to "phone home".  DRM does nothing to combat piracy and only places restrictions on those people who legally obtain the product.