PS4 and Xbox One resolution / frame rate discussion

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

I'm so lost right now :rofl: Need to visit Gaf more to stay on top of these rumours.

 

Surely Titanfall is gold by now and common knowledge behind the scenes what the final map count is? CBOAT has probably waited for this so he isn't singling himself out.

 

As for ntkrnl, I've no idea how he fits into it all. Lucky break on leak info? Has he even posted since he leaked Halo 2A etc?

 

And Jonathan Leack? wtf is that? Some clickbait journalist or something?

 

I'll just wait for the DF analysis (Y) :p

 

Anyway, let's not make this personal and keep it about "resolutiongate", please.

 

Jonathan definitely doesn't do himself any favours as an "impartial, honest and fact reporting journalist". But to be fair do many of them exist? :p

 

The fun part of GAF is the leakwars and then detective GAF. It's thoroughly enjoying watching usernames identites/pasts get uncovered. The gamers CSI :laugh: But being honest it's the kind of things you could only see on such a big board, so even if you don't like the place it's enjoyable to see the drama unfold from the shadows.

 

As for Titanfall Andy if cboats rumours are to be believed "fixed party chat" is on the line right up until release, so gold or not there's probably day -1 patches being prepared (that could easily be aimed at the technical side as well, aka AC4 PS4).

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Jonathan definitely doesn't do himself any favours as an "impartial, honest and fact reporting journalist". But to be fair do many of them exist? :p

 

The fun part of GAF is the leakwars and then detective GAF. It's thoroughly enjoying watching usernames identites/pasts get uncovered. The gamers CSI :laugh: But being honest it's the kind of things you could only see on such a big board, so even if you don't like the place it's enjoyable to see the drama unfold from the shadows.

 

As for Titanfall Andy if cboats rumours are to be believed "fixed party chat" is on the line right up until release, so gold or not there's probably day -1 patches being prepared (that could easily be aimed at the technical side as well, aka AC4 PS4).

 

Well the party chat thing has me wondering too. AFAIK there hasn't been any mention of day 1 patches, they must be cutting it fine for timing :/ Why not just delay the game for the same week TF releases on 360?

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Well the party chat thing has me wondering too. AFAIK there hasn't been any mention of day 1 patches, they must be cutting it fine for timing :/ Why not just delay the game for the same week TF releases on 360?

 

Hasn't there been a deadly silence about the 360 version? I think it might not be a choice to fire it out later, but necessity. It's Bluepoint Games handling it right?

 

Also, you release the XB1 version first, you might force the impatient to buy an XB1?

 

famousmortimer on GAF

 

And FWIW, I was just told that 792p is the minimum it will be. 

I think cboat is just wrong about this one. We shall see soon enough, I guess.

 

 

Someone from Respawn

 

So, who wants to take on a ban bet on any of these? :)

 

 

Probably a dud from cboat. To be honest it is strange watching developers get right into the thick of the leakwars rather than the "no comment".

[trooper11]

Probably a dud from cboat. To be honest it is strange watching developers get right into the thick of the leakwars rather than the "no comment".

 

 

I think that some developers are getting tired of these leaks and how people react to them.  It may not be smart pr wise, but human being wise, it is sometimes difficult to just ignore a big negative reaction to something you know is not true or know is not the whole story.

 

I'm not saying this is the case here, but when there are false leaks/rumors, you know its got to be frustrating for these people.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

I think that some developers are getting tired of these leaks and how people react to them.  It may not be smart pr wise, but human being wise, it is sometimes difficult to just ignore a big negative reaction to something you know is not true or know is not the whole story.

 

I'm not saying this is the case here, but when there are false leaks/rumors, you know its got to be frustrating for these people.

 

Well here we go, case closed

 

"We?re not dropping the resolution for launch. Nothing has changed from what we?ve said in recent interviews."

 

Source: http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/02/24/titanfall-respawn-denies-rumors-on-resolution-drop-to-720p-on-xbox-one/

 

There's no way any company would dare go on record like that 2 weeks away from release. Crazy how an individual/gaming board can force a response from PR/marketing so quickly over a games resolution.

 

Cboat to be banned on GAF it seems, admins already said he's getting the axe if it's untrue - At least that should silence the "NeoGAF is a Sony board" nonsense.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Well here we go, case closed

 

 

Source: http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/02/24/titanfall-respawn-denies-rumors-on-resolution-drop-to-720p-on-xbox-one/

 

There's no way any company would dare go on record like that 2 weeks away from release. Crazy how an individual/gaming board can force a response from PR/marketing so quickly over a games resolution.

 

Cboat to be banned on GAF it seems, admins already said he's getting the axe if it's untrue - At least that should silence the "NeoGAF is a Sony board" nonsense.

 

Just catching up on it as it breaks over there. Finally making a bit more sense to me now.

 

If he has been misled can't he provide his source to mods? Even if it's wrong, he could have been intentionally fed false info to post.

 

I'm still waiting for DF's analysis on Thief and TF personally, these rumours are fun to watch but cold hard facts any day (Y) That Jonathan Leach guy or whatever is a joke too :laugh:

[trooper11]

 Crazy how an individual/gaming board can force a response from PR/marketing so quickly over a games resolution.

 

Cboat to be banned on GAF it seems, admins already said he's getting the axe if it's untrue - At least that should silence the "NeoGAF is a Sony board" nonsense.

 

I dont think its too crazy.  NeoGAF is a force in the online gaming community.  Rumors that come from it are treated as very credible and are usually a call to action throughout the internet.

 

Developers are very much aware of how damaging a rumor coming out of GAF can be, true or not. Ignoring it can be taken as admitting its correct.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Just catching up on it as it breaks over there. Finally making a bit more sense to me now.

 

If he has been misled can't he provide his source to mods? Even if it's wrong, he could have been intentionally fed false info to post.

 

I'm still waiting for DF's analysis on Thief and TF personally, these rumours are fun to watch but cold hard facts any day (Y) That Jonathan Leach guy or whatever is a joke too :laugh:

 

Microsoft found CBOAT

They kept it quiet

Now Microsoft is using his own account to discredit him

 

:laugh:

 

It is funny to think but in boardrooms across Sony/Nintendo/Microsoft genuine discussions are held to find out who the #### "crazy buttocks on a train" is.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

 

 

:laugh:

 

It is funny to think but in boardrooms across Sony/Nintendo/Microsoft genuine discussions are held to find out who the #### "crazy buttocks on a train" is.

 

 

:laugh:

 

There's something not right though. Why put your neck on the line when the beta already had better textures/res? I think there might be some truth to the feeding him false info comments.

[trooper11]

I'm still waiting for DF's analysis on Thief and TF personally, these rumours are fun to watch but cold hard facts any day (Y) That Jonathan Leach guy or whatever is a joke too :laugh:

 

 

:laugh:

 

It is funny to think but in boardrooms across Sony/Nintendo/Microsoft genuine discussions are held to find out who the #### "crazy buttocks on a train" is.

You two sound like people that are obsessed with watching soap operas :laugh:

I think hearing the highlights that you guys post is more than enough drama for me.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

:laugh:

 

There's something not right though. Why put your neck on the line when the beta already had better textures/res? I think there might be some truth to the feeding him false info comments.

 

There is something strangely addictive to reading the gossip, it's crazy. From FamousMortimer now that ntkrnl is being spoke about a lot on GAF (surprisingly he/she has disappeared)

 

ntkrnl was a controlled leak, imo. It was good info. The titanfall xbox did exist, they just decided against it due to cost. The halo hd games are coming. The thing that stood out to me about him was that he had nothing negative to say about microsoft. It was 100% positive. Having talked to many people at many different companies there isn't a single one that is 100% positive about the place they work. That was the first thing that made me believe that he was a controlled leaker.

 

 

The second thing is that when I tweeted that I believed he was a controlled leaker I got the most insane email ever from someone high up in the xbox division. Just crazy "we don't give a ###### about buttocks, this ntkrnl guy is harming our business, we want to know who he is!" I replied back saying I knew who he was, out of general curiosity to their response, there was none. Also, why in the ###### would MS give a ###### that I told a couple thousand people on twitter that my belief was that ntkrnl was a controlled leak? 

 

 

This industry is ######ing bonkers.

 

 

http://neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=102152051&postcount=244

 

Sorry this is going a little off resolutiongate, parts of this topic are made up from leak drama.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

 

 

You two sound like people that are obsessed with watching soap operas :laugh:

I think hearing the highlights that you guys post is more than enough drama for me.

 

I actually hate drama on the internet, I'm just in it for the leaks. I have my opinions about it all, but I'm not sucked into it following topics for 100 pages etc like some do (not a stab at AB, just talking about the crazy topics they have over there :P)

 

Like I say, I'll gladly wait for the DF articles (Y)

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

I actually hate drama on the internet, I'm just in it for the leaks. I have my opinions about it all, but I'm not sucked into it following topics for 100 pages etc like some do (not a stab at AB, just talking about the crazy topics they have over there :p)

 

Like I say, I'll gladly wait for the DF articles (Y)

 

FU! I love lurking in the drama for the GIFs, people melting down, and insane theories. But yeah some people on GAF even make me look completely sane. At the end of the day though DF will post the facts and all this talking 2 weeks before release becomes irrelevant (even more so now that it seems like FUD).

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

There is something strangely addictive to reading the gossip, it's crazy. From FamousMortimer now that ntkrnl is being spoke about a lot on GAF (surprisingly he/she has disappeared)

 

 

http://neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=102152051&postcount=244

 

Sorry this is going a little off resolutiongate, parts of this topic are made up from leak drama.

 

It's fine to post stuff if it leaks over on Gaf, but keep it to the resolution stuff. The CBOAT stuff is just barely on topic to allow it ;)

[Hedon]

I would wait for Digital Foundry as reviews aren't exactly praising the XB1 version either, sounds like the game is just a mess.

3.5/10 - http://www.egmnow.com/articles/reviews/egm-review-thief/

Been reading more and it is sounding like the X1 is the definitive version. It's bound to happen where the 3rd party games were going to improve on the X1 anyway. They are continuing to wrap their head around the X1 development. Great news for all gamers.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Been reading more and it is sounding like the X1 is the definitive version. It's bound to happen where the 3rd party games were going to improve on the X1 anyway. They are continuing to wrap their head around the X1 development. Great news for all gamers.

It would be good to know where you're reading this other than craves fanboy author. Not one other respectable review quotes anything like Crave. They simply talk about issues while being platform agnostic.

All we know for certain right now is one is 1080p, one 900p and there are technical issues. I've already posted EGMs review who reviewed the XB1 copy, so if you've read something I've not please post it to backup your definitive comments.

[Houtei]

Yeah from what ive seen so far from almost everyone thats played both is they both look the same and they both have frame rate drops to almost unbearable throughout however the xbox is much more stable though still with problems.   So it seems xbox manages a little less stressful experience but ps4 went for the ability to say 1080p to sell copies.   I have played the xo version for about 3 hours so far and i had twice now the framerate got real jumpy but overall its looked pretty good.  The gameplay though is not anywhere near as good as i was expecting though from thief but still kinda fun.

[truthfax]

PS4 hardware: +6 CUs, +560 GFlops, +16 ROPs, +8 ACEs/CQs, better GPGPU support, currently better performing CPU, and faster unified memory. PS4's OS may also have less overhead or reserves.

There are only two "hardware limit" increases to the Xbox GPU, one is the pre-launch upclock, two is the 8% GPU reserve reduction in an upcoming update. Anything else is software level improvements that can't make up the hardware gap. That includes any updated SDKs/drivers, which have room for improvement on both consoles.

Xbox?s 16 ROPs and ESRAM size/width limits are causing bottlenecks, on top of the weaker GPU and GPGPU ability. It will never completely catch up in games performance. Any talk about PS4 being bottlenecked by latency or 'offloading' is wrong. It's like saying a Radeon 7770 will beat a 7850, it's impossible. Only exception are games where performance isn't being pushed like indie and sports games (FIFA, etc.), or unoptimized/poorly running last gen engines like CoD: Ghosts or Thief.

Both consoles are capable of AMD's GCN sparse texture hardware level function. This is exposed to the PS4 and Xbox through different APIs, but the underlying hardware is almost certainly the same. Tiled Resources improves memory bandwidth and size usage, it can help get around Xbox's ESRAM width/size limits, but it won't make the GPU better at rendering. The ESRAM needs to be used for the framebuffer, not storing textures.

Even if devs get around ESRAM size/width bottlenecks to go from 720-900p to 1080p, there will still be a corresponding framerate drop as 1080p puts a heavier rendering load on the GPU. It's not a free lunch. Even assuming you had 1000GB/s and 1000GB mem width and size, the GPU and ROPs are only capable of so much rendering.

PS4 has greater GPGPU support for enhanced physics and you can expect to see more things like MGS's weather simulation missing on Xbox. Other examples of GPGPU are Resogun's voxels, infamous' particle system, and The Order's soft body, cloth, and object physics.

As far as software issues, it seems Xbox's SDK/drivers are lagging behind and the OS virtualization has a heavier overhead than PS4, furthering PS4s performance lead. That may or may not be possible to fix in the future. The performance gap will probably shrink, but only to the extent the hardware allows. There will never be full parity, you can expect 720p-900p or 900p-1080p the entire gen.

All of this has been known since before launch, it's just taken longer for some of it to sink in for some people.

[trooper11]

All of this has been known since before launch, it's just taken longer for some of it to sink in for some people.

Exactly.

The sooner everyone digests this, the sooner we can get away from these silly arguments and obsession over a numbers fight.

the PS4 will lead, and the X1 will follow, simple as that. As times goes on, both will be improved to maximize performance, so, as you said, the X1 will get better and the gap might shrink, but it is not going to magically remove the very real hardware differences.

Once you get over the 'console wars', you can just worry about the games coming to both consoles and get the ones that appeal to you. If Nintendo has proven anything, its that good games will sell regardless of how a console stacks up technically against others.

[Hedon]

Exactly.

The sooner everyone digests this, the sooner we can get away from these silly arguments and obsession over a numbers fight.

the PS4 will lead, and the X1 will follow, simple as that. As times goes on, both will be improved to maximize performance, so, as you said, the X1 will get better and the gap might shrink, but it is not going to magically remove the very real hardware differences.

Once you get over the 'console wars', you can just worry about the games coming to both consoles and get the ones that appeal to you. If Nintendo has proven anything, its that good games will sell regardless of how a console stacks up technically against others.

Not sure how anyone could argue that the PS4 isn't more powerful on paper either. Both consoles are capable of producing 1080p/60fps titles. Both will do a better job of it going forward. What the PS4 can do though, better than the X1 is take it to the next level BEYOND 1080p/60fps. Both systems will support 4k gaming, but the X1 doesn't stand a chance of matching the PS4 with content higher than 1080p/60fps.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Not sure how anyone could argue that the PS4 isn't more powerful on paper either. Both consoles are capable of producing 1080p/60fps titles. Both will do a better job of it going forward. What the PS4 can do though, better than the X1 is take it to the next level BEYOND 1080p/60fps. Both systems will support 4k gaming, but the X1 doesn't stand a chance of matching the PS4 with content higher than 1080p/60fps.

 

There is absolutely no way the PS4 can do 4K gaming. Video yes, not gaming.

[trooper11]

There is absolutely no way the PS4 can do 4K gaming. Video yes, not gaming.

Yeah, both can output 4k, but neither can hope do do that for gaming.

Now, it will be interesting to see 1080p games upscaled to 4k. It would be up to the quality of the scaler that the ps4 or x1 uses.

[Houtei]

Yes neither console will move off 1080p for a long time. Regardless if it can. Simply because theres just no reason to on a console because of resolution constraints on TVs.  I would guess 99.98% of console users dont have the ability to display over 1080p some still not even that.  Need to stop thinking like a pc gamer with our 4k capable 24" screens sitting 1 foot away.  I know 1 person with a 4k 65" tv and he spent 5grand on it and he has NOTHING that actually displays that high.

 

1080p 60fps is basically a wall this generation. Which is why i think in the resugate game xo will catch up but by that time "maybe" they can put more pretty things in the ps4 version but i do not ever see it doing over 1080p 60fps.  Will have higher 60fps stability but prolly never go over.

[Hedon]

There is absolutely no way the PS4 can do 4K gaming. Video yes, not gaming.

I am just going by what Sony and Microsoft official spokesmen have said about 4K gaming. If you want to argue with them, that is fine. But don't shoot the messenger:

 

http://www.stuff.tv/microsoft/sony-ps4-vs-xbox-one-4k-war-begins/feature

 

Sony's Senior VP Worldwide Studios Europe Michael Denny told Stuff however that although Sony isn't "looking at 4K gaming initially, [it is] looking at 4K video and stills images. [4K gaming] is something [it] will look at in future".

 

?We are delivering a home entertainment system for the next generation and will support 4K for games and entertainment. We?ll share more details later on 4K content for Xbox One.?

[LaP]

Yeah, both can output 4k, but neither can hope do do that for gaming.

Now, it will be interesting to see 1080p games upscaled to 4k. It would be up to the quality of the scaler that the ps4 or x1 uses.

 

Don't know about the One but the upscaler in the xbox 360 is not really better than the one in my TV. The gfx quality is about the same when outputting 360 games at 720p or 1080p.