DocM Posted April 1, 2017 Author Share Posted April 1, 2017 The first reused Dragon, CRS-11 - formerly CRS-4, is getting ready to ship. Emn1ty, BetaguyGZT and SALSN 3 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597845188 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 22 hours ago, DocM said: This is going to put serious heat on ULA/Boeing/LockMart as regards Vulcan "reuse" by way of parachuting the engine bay & engines, catching it with a chopper. This design still needs solid boosters. I see 3 possible outcomes for such a stupid idea. 1. No pilot will agree to attempting something so monstrously stupid, nor will the FAA or other similar organisations 2. A clean miss 3. A dead chopper crew Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597845334 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 1, 2017 Author Share Posted April 1, 2017 (edited) Such retrievals were done of US Corona spysat film return capsules, and the Ryan Firebee recon drones over SE Asia from 1964-1975. Thousands of missions. The Vulcan engine bay would be larger, but the principle is proven. Just a bit costly and a logistical nightmare vs. doing as God and Robert A. Heinlein intended Ryan Firebee Go to 3:45 of this video to see a chopper snatch a parachuting drone Edited April 1, 2017 by DocM Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597845362 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulRocket Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 11 hours ago, DocM said: The first reused Dragon, CRS-11 - formerly CRS-4, is getting ready to ship. Is it correct that a Dragon costs about $50-60M? Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597845486 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SALSN Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 Didn't they use to have prices on the SpaceX.com site? Just looked, but don't see any for the dragon? Found this one for the rockets though: http://www.spacex.com/about/capabilities Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597845490 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 1, 2017 Author Share Posted April 1, 2017 (edited) 4 hours ago, PaulRocket said: Is it correct that a Dragon costs about $50-60M? Under the CRS Round 1 contract SpaceX was allocated 12 missions at a cost of $1.6 billion, or about $133.3 million a mission. Musk has said about half of this was the cost of Dragon 1, so about $67.7 million. This contract was extended twice, first adding 3 missions then another 5 for a total of 20 CRS missions and at each an inflation factor was applied. These missions now cost about $140 million each. SpaceX, OrbitalATK and Sierra Nevada were each awarded 6 initial CRS Round 2 missions with SpaceX getting the highest evaluation score and per mission award, but that amount isn't accurately known yet. The total CRS Round 2 contract for all 3 providers maxes out at $14 billion, counting 6 missions each and the likely additional missions past those, and as stated SpaceX will get the largest chunk. All SpaceX CRS Round 2 missions will fly using Dragon 2, and the baseline mission includes propulsive landings at LZ-1. What's interesting about CRS Round 2 is that both Boeing's CST-100 Starliner and Lockheed's entry were eliminated early. Starliner couldn't hold enough pressurized cargo/mission, and Lockheed was eliminated for high costs and mission complexity - it required 2 vehicles. Edited April 1, 2017 by DocM SALSN and PaulRocket 2 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597845660 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 1, 2017 Author Share Posted April 1, 2017 (edited) Whoah...FH has the potential for 26.4 tonnes to GEO? SALSN and BetaguyGZT 2 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597845674 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulRocket Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 20 minutes ago, DocM said: Under the CRS Round 1 contract SpaceX was allocated 12 missions at a cost of $1.6 billion, or about $133.3 million a mission. Musk has said about half of this was the cost of Dragon 1, so about $67.7 million. This contract was extended twice, first adding 3 missions then another 5 for a total of 20 CRS missions and at each an inflation factor was applied. These missions now cost about $140 million each. SpaceX, OrbitalATK and Sierra Nevada were each awarded 6 initial CRS Round 2 missions with SpaceX getting the highest evaluation score and per mission award, but that amount isn't accurately known yet. The total CRS Round 2 contract for all 3 providers maxes out at $14 billion, counting 6 missions each and the likely additional missions past those, and as stated SpaceX will get the largest chunk. All SpaceX CRS Round 2 missions will fly using Dragon 2, and the baseline mission includes propulsive landings at LZ-1. What's interesting about CRS Round 2 is that both Boeing's CST-100 Starliner and Lockheed's entry were eliminated early. Starliner couldn't hold enough pressurized cargo/mission, and Lockheed was eliminated for high costs and mission complexity - it required 2 vehicles. Thanks for the answer! Looks like SpaceX will have a lot of Dragons sitting around waiting for being reused on some commercial missions. Regarding 24h refurbishment time, do we know if SpaceX is still planning on getting Brownsville up and running by 2018? I imagine this is quite important since they will probably be limited to one launch per 2 weeks at the Cape... Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597845682 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 1, 2017 Author Share Posted April 1, 2017 (edited) 2018 still appears to be "the plan," and things are moving there with road improvements, lots of surveying, and the STARGATE tracking/R&D building having gone up. One 10 meter tracking dish is up, and anothers base has been poured. More land acquisitions too. We'll likely see major cement work soon. And keep in mind: this is a $100 million project, and a lot of it has been soil preparation - as in drying it out. This takes installing thousands of deep "wick drains," a lot of dirt piled on top for weight, and time. Edited April 1, 2017 by DocM PaulRocket and SALSN 2 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597845698 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 4, 2017 Author Share Posted April 4, 2017 Emn1ty, SteveL, FloatingFatMan and 2 others 5 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597848020 Share on other sites More sharing options...
philcruicks Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 SES-10 Stage 1 Landing Vid has been released: https://www.instagram.com/p/BSfJDjMFzwR/ BetaguyGZT 1 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597850078 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 5, 2017 Author Share Posted April 5, 2017 BetaguyGZT 1 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597851038 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 5, 2017 Author Share Posted April 5, 2017 BetaguyGZT 1 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597851052 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 5, 2017 Author Share Posted April 5, 2017 Re: upper stage reusability BetaguyGZT 1 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597851100 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 5, 2017 Author Share Posted April 5, 2017 BetaguyGZT 1 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597851110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaguyGZT Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 Italy really had no other option. The unrest in French Guiana is reaching avalanche proportions. Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597851166 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 6, 2017 Author Share Posted April 6, 2017 BetaguyGZT 1 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597851240 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 6, 2017 Author Share Posted April 6, 2017 This video seems so prescient 6 years later....and the music choice of Uprising (Muse) was absolutely perfect. CC: Richard Shelby > They will not force us They will stop degrading us They will not control us We will be victorious (So come on) Emn1ty and BetaguyGZT 2 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597851388 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 6, 2017 Author Share Posted April 6, 2017 (edited) AFSS = Air Force-speak for SpaceX's exclusive Autonomous Flight Termination System (AFTS) BetaguyGZT 1 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597852594 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 8, 2017 Author Share Posted April 8, 2017 BetaguyGZT, SALSN and Emn1ty 3 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597854830 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaguyGZT Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 *mic drop*. DocM 1 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597854840 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SALSN Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 I kind of feel sorry for the competitors, SpaceX is killing it, they really have to pull some impressive stuff out of their hats to keep up! Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597855016 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetaguyGZT Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 They've already lost. There's so much coming down the pipe in the next two years that it would take OldSpace probably twenty years to get to this point IF they could be bothered to try. Let alone have any kind of forward-thinking or risk-taking in the underlying technologies that have gotten SpaceX this far already. Nope. I keep saying this, but it's really the only thing that can sum it up. OldSpace are really just here for the Participation trophies at this point. The best they can do is to latch onto one of the NewSpace companies like leeches (and they have, in fact -- Blue Origin) and try to survive. OldSpace is at the mercy of NewSpace, make no mistake. They had their chance to do things their way, develop their own engine and completely pish-poshed the funding. Now they've missed the train. And the plane. And the boat. And finally the rocket. The AR-1 engine, while halfway decent, is really, really out of step and out of touch with current technology -- and still three years from being ready for anything. It should have been ready TEN years ago when it was REALLY needed. And they'd better thank their lucky stars that Elon and Bezos aren't absolute sharks ... because if the tables were turned, NewSpace would have already been plowed under without a second glance. SALSN and DocM 2 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597855162 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SALSN Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 I completely agree with your assessment, I was actually thinking about the other new space companies, Blue Origin seems to have something to show, but stuff like Orbital, I'm not so sure about, and Virgin Galactic seems to be postponing indefinitely, while their product slowly becomes less and less impressive in comparison to the competitors tech and prices. What about the Dream chaser will there still be a market for that one when the Dragon 2 is flying? We don't need a new monopoly situation, even if it is SpaceX sitting on the monopoly. bguy_1986 1 Share Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597855212 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocM Posted April 8, 2017 Author Share Posted April 8, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, SALSN said: > Whatabout the Dream chaser will there still be a market for that one when the Dragon 2 is flying? > Dream Chaser has a CRS Round 2 ISS cargo contract, joining SpaceX and OrbitalATK, and is ramping to another glide/landing test. Part of this development is a big cargo Trunk to meet the CRS Round 2 volume requirements. Fun fact: Dream Chaser beat out both Boeing and Lockheed Martin in the competition. They're also working with Germany and a few others on DC4E, Dream Chaser for Europe, to fly on Ariane. This should let them fly to either the ISS or Chinese station. Part of this work is that Dream Chaser would use a European built version of the International Docking Adapter. CRS R2 unmanned Dream Chaser Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/1305746-spacex-updates-thread-8/page/23/#findComment-597855256 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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