Backing up DVD / blu ray & CD collection?

[Technique]

I've just ripped my final (i think) Blu-Ray and i've 2 questions. One is specific to this DVD from what i've seen so far and the other i've noticed on other rips too.

 

1)

 

What would that be all about? 2 Titles pretty much the same size, same amount of chapters. I guess they're both the actual movie but why would it be showing twice? And which would you select? I ripped the one that i checked in the image. First time i've seen this on a rip.

 

 

2)

 

I've seen this one in most of my rips. I always unselect foreign languages and keep English audio and subtitles checked.

Why so many English audios though? I just select them all to 'play safe'.

[DevTech]

18 minutes ago, Technique said:

I've just ripped my final (i think) Blu-Ray and i've 2 questions. One is specific to this DVD from what i've seen so far and the other i've noticed on other rips too.

 

 

 

What would that be all about? 2 Titles pretty much the same size, same amount of chapters. I guess they're both the actual movie but why would it be showing twice? And which would you select? I ripped the one that i checked in the image. First time i've seen this on a rip.

 

 

2)

I've seen this one in most of my rips. I always unselect foreign languages and keep English audio and subtitles checked.

Why so many English audios though? I just select them all to 'play safe'.

This is where you may need to do some reading to understand formats... or just keep asking here which might be just as practical...

 

1. Read the text - 2 versions on movie - the Theatre Release and "Unrated" which you can see is a bit larger and probably includes "censored" scenes

 

2. Lots of audio formats due to the different types of audio equipment people have 

 

- selecting all the audio formats gives you flexibility in the future if you upgrade equipment

or even multiple playback locations with different equipment 

- i.e. "stereo" works everywhere, DTS 5.1 Channel is the surround with speakers in all 4 corners of the room - great in a living room, useless on a tablet...

 

 

 

[Technique]

I figured more audio/subtitle options couldn't harm anything which is why i ticked it all.

 

Wasn't quite sure what unrated was which is why i selected the other option. You make a point though - unrated is a larger file & should've maybe been selected instead.

[DevTech]

4 hours ago, Technique said:

I figured more audio/subtitle options couldn't harm anything which is why i ticked it all.

 

Wasn't quite sure what unrated was which is why i selected the other option. You make a point though - unrated is a larger file & should've maybe been selected instead.

Well, this one is partially in the realm of "Movie Critic"

 

Many movies of great fame and origin will have a variety of versions which are often documented on Wikipedia and other sites

 

Most of these versions have enough of a difference that a separate disc release is required to handle major changes to the movies.

 

But you have encountered the simple exception to that, pieces of the movie that have been just snipped right out.

 

In the case of "simple cuts" and "alternate endings" the various disc formats have been designed to handle that and your RIP software is showing the result of a slightly different path through assembling the pieces.

 

 

Types that can often sit on the same disc:

 

1. Original Movie release

 

2. Original movie release uncensored

 

- seconds here and there or even entire scenes put back in that were removed by either official or self-imposed censorship 

- most censorship acts on just seconds of a scene and is sometimes done by the studio against the director's wishes to achieve a younger age limit to yield more sales

- warning: for some people, the bits cut out would be uncomfortable to watch making the "unrated" version less enjoyable

 

3. Director's Cut (some of them)

 

- often large segments of the movie are removed by the studio against the director's wishes to enable a 90 minute runtime and the Director's cut restores the original intent

- if it is just 100% material CUT, the disc format can accommodate it

- many Director's Cuts have significant editing differences and are NOT able to share space with the original movie.

 

 

 

 

 

[Technique]

I did a bit of Googling after the last post and found the uncensored directors cut version did indeed last 2hrs47mins - exactly the length of the video i ripped later on.

 

I'll keep both on the drive anyway.

[DevTech]

Director's Cut Warning: sometimes it just makes the movie tedious and boring in the full version

 

Very subjective

 

IMO the Giant Special Case: 3 hours vs 4.5 hours for the 3 Lord of the Rings movies

 

- the vast majority of humanity watched the 3 hour version and mocked people who watched the 4.5 hour version

- It's hard to imagine actually, but I thoroughly enjoyed every minute of the Extended 4.5 hour version

 

 

[DevTech]

4 hours ago, Technique said:

I figured more audio/subtitle options couldn't harm anything which is why i ticked it all.

 

Wasn't quite sure what unrated was which is why i selected the other option. You make a point though - unrated is a larger file & should've maybe been selected instead.

The downside of multiple audio is remembering to select the "right" one on playback

 

you want to "face palm" when you realize you just watched a great 2 hour movie in stereo instead of 5.1 surround!

 

[Technique]

1 hour ago, DevTech said:

The downside of multiple audio is remembering to select the "right" one on playback

 

you want to "face palm" when you realize you just watched a great 2 hour movie in stereo instead of 5.1 surround!

 

I probably would face palm ... IF i had 5.1 surround, which i don't

 

Though i am considering a soundbar as an alternative. But now we're about a million miles off topic so i'll leave it there.

[DevTech]

13 minutes ago, Technique said:

I probably would face palm ... IF i had 5.1 surround, which i don't

 

Though i am considering a soundbar as an alternative. But now we're about a million miles off topic so i'll leave it there.

Despite some minor grumps from people not seeing the big picture in this thread, I don't think there has been much topic shifting when you consider that the real topic title is:

 

"I don't know anything about digital media and want to set up a home server maybe and mostly only will ever have old retro DVD media and I'm really confused and have very limited time and will appreciate all sorts of input and help to get to an interesting destination of some sort"

 

So setting up the playback audio environment seems right in the middle of the topic anyways unless audio is not important to movie viewing, which could be true if your entire collection is from the "Silent Film" era...

 

What I do, is just keep a 5.1 Dolby or DTS track unless only stereo is available.

 

For stereo input, I have my 5.1 home theater set to synthesize a 5.1 output for a stereo input which is why the "face palm" is easier than you might think since there is always "something" coming out of all the speakers.

 

For playback on devices that only have stereo, I am fortunate to be able to select players that can process 5.1 input and combine it into plain old stereo.

 

For people that are constrained to keep multiple audio tracks, I think there is a way to set one of them as the DEFAULT.

 

 

[+BudMan MVC]

Yes there is a way to set a track as default.. Simple header manipulate after makemkv rips it with https://mkvtoolnix.download/

 

It can in preference and even with a xml setup what track should be marked as default with makemkv - it just way easier to make them what you want with mkvtoolnix.. Yes it runs on windows!   Also easy to set all kinds of extra info here if you want like language and Names that will show up.. It has a slick chapter editor that will allow you to name your chapters..

 

 

So vs just numbers you can have them list say Fight Scene or Kewl Part where XYZ, etc .etc..

 

He will want to make sure his system actually works with the audio tracks he wants to keep or set as default.  Depending on what he is using to play them. What does his stick support, doesn't always matter what his AVR might support.. His stick might convert that to PCM vs TRUE-HD 7.1, etc.  Also how is he getting the audio from his player to his AVR.. Is via optical toslink from TV, via ARC through some other HDMI.. That has limits to what audio can be used as well..

 

Normally you would plug your stick or player info your AVR, where the audio would be picked up off the hdmi feed into your AVR.. Only thing out to the TV would be the video via hdmi..

[Technique]

Just to say that i'm not actually using any stick. Since the TV has a Plex app i'm just using the TV.

 

Also i had a bit of a discussion with Budman yesterday but where do you other guys see the future of Plex, or even just what we're discussing here in general?

 

Sure i may be 'late to the party' but it's obviously still 'a thing'. If Plex is likely to shut down within 6 months then all this might be a tad pointless but i don't imagine it would do, though i have nothing to base this prediction on. I guess perhaps Plex is 'the biggie' but there are alternatives (which is why i said what we're discussing here in general).

 

I concede that what Budman says is very likely correct in a way. I don't agree with him that "Optical media is dead" as i can walk in to my HMV store and see racks and racks of CDs and DVDs and see people buying them, however i do accept that it is dying.

So right now we acquire DVDs, Blu-Rays, CDs one way or another. We buy them, we rent them, we loan them, whatever. They come in to our possession. They end up in our library after we rip them & then Plex does all that good stuff.

 

But there'll come a day (who knows when?!) when CDs and DVDs are like cassettes and everything will be streamed.

 

What then?? Can't really put it in your library. Great for big movies that SHOULD be around forever and a day but what about that no name movie that you actually really like? Can pick it up no problem in the year it came out but now it's 5 years later and you can't find it for love nor money. If you had a disc you would've ripped it to your library but now everything is streamed so you're SOL??

 

 

And to go a little further, in what way do you think we'll be limited, if at all, with streaming? Do you expect you'll need an Apple player of sorts, a Google player of sorts, so on & so forth? Right now you just need a DVD player that'll play your region DVD but will streams depend on what you're playing them on? You'll have to pay £XX to stream on your Apple device but then if you want to view the same movie after you decide you're no longer an Apple fan & you've moved to Android you'll have to pay for the movie all over again - which you wouldn't have done had you had a disc and ripped it to your library.

 

 

Sure you can sit there & say i'm getting way ahead of myself but that's the point of the discussion - where do you see it heading?

[dipsylalapo Supervisor]

With regards to Plex, I wouldn't see it disappearing overnight, but if it does there are plenty of alternatives that will get better if Plex were to disappear. 

 

On optical media, it probably is dying. I stream most of the stuff that I watch, but still buy a a few Blu Rays occasionally. For those that are more experienced in this that myself, does streaming vs Blu Ray have a similar debate as Spotify vs CD/Vinyl? I would assume so, and that the stuff we stream is good but not great. 

 

These services also lose (and gain) content all the time, so that favourite TV show may disappear to a different service so feel like having a physical media back up isn't a bad idea.

[+BudMan MVC]

Plex is not going to die off any time soon... They keep trying to make it more typical user friendly.. They just setup some integration with tribal, and they have the whole podcast thing.. But then they go and do stuff that pisses off the more experienced users by working on removing plugins, etc..

 

But as the whole landscape of media consumption changes - it will all change..  This is not an issue for normal people   But for people that are always 10 years late to a party, and don't like change in the first place.. Then yeah your prob going to have issues as you pick something to finally start to use..

 

Like your whole live mail thing, that was EOL over 2 years ago that your still grasping onto since you "hate" anything that changes... Let me guess you just last year moved to 7 from XP

 

So if your using the app on your TV, how do you get the sound to your sound system?  Are you just using the TV speakers?  How your sound works will determine which audio tracks to make default, or which ones to keep in your rips.. Is there any reason to keep all of the different audio tracks if you can only actual leverage 1 of them, etc.  And then maybe your TV doesn't even know how to decode DTS for example and so plex will have to transcode that or some other protocols to something your TV can use, etc.

[Technique]

1 hour ago, BudMan said:

But as the whole landscape of media consumption changes - it will all change..  This is not an issue for normal people   But for people that are always 10 years late to a party, and don't like change in the first place.. Then yeah your prob going to have issues as you pick something to finally start to use..

 

Like your whole live mail thing, that was EOL over 2 years ago that your still grasping onto since you "hate" anything that changes... Let me guess you just last year moved to 7 from XP

 

So if your using the app on your TV, how do you get the sound to your sound system?  Are you just using the TV speakers?  How your sound works will determine which audio tracks to make default, or which ones to keep in your rips.. Is there any reason to keep all of the different audio tracks if you can only actual leverage 1 of them, etc.  And then maybe your TV doesn't even know how to decode DTS for example and so plex will have to transcode that or some other protocols to something your TV can use, etc.

I see it seems to bother you that i don't jump onto ALL change. Strange, because it doesn't bother me. Change isn't necessarily for the best. How often do the 'old guys' (maybe you've said this phrase yourself, but then probably not since all change is for the best with you?) say .... "they don't make them like they used to"? Equally not all change is bad, which is why i've told you, more than once, that i don't dismiss all change just like i don't jump on all of it either.

 

Which makes your "hate anything that changes" statement absolute nonsense ... and you know it

 

I know you're just taking the ssip but for the record i moved to Windows 7 from XP back in 2010. I would've moved slightly sooner - i bought the disc in 2009 but i was waiting on having the funds to build my own PC which ended up being a few months later in 2010. I didn't accept the change to Windows 8 because it looked absolute tosh which is also why i had absolute zero interest in those Windows phones. The whole tiles thing was imo hideous. I'd have switched to a Mac way before i switched to any of that tile crap.

 

How do i get the sound to my sound system? I turn the volume up So yeah, i'm using the TV speakers. Ok they're not the best but they work for now. I'm not going to go down the route of installing surround sound however i am interested in Soundbars.

 

The way i see it is if i include all the English audio & subtitles then if anything changes down the line then it'll be included in the rip and it'll be an available option. What i don't want is for the situation to change only for me to not then be able to make the most of it. For now though the situation is basic so the audio will work as it is.

[DevTech]

On 12/10/2018 at 6:05 AM, Technique said:

Sure i may be 'late to the party' but it's obviously still 'a thing'. If Plex is likely to shut down within 6 months then all this might be a tad pointless but i don't imagine it would do, though i have nothing to base this prediction on. I guess perhaps Plex is 'the biggie' but there are alternatives (which is why i said what we're discussing here in general).

https://www.neowin.net/news/serviio-1101

 

Just posted on Neowin main page.

 

And lots of others that I posted early on in this thread...

 

You just happen more or less by accident to be having conversations with fans of Plex. But lots of other media organizers to download and try out to see if they are more fun to play with...

 

[+BudMan MVC]

Yup already mentioned there are lots of them.. Took him a month to try plex.. You think his tv with is LIMITED apps going to support that one

[DevTech]

19 minutes ago, BudMan said:

Yup already mentioned there are lots of them.. Took him a month to try plex.. You think his tv with is LIMITED apps going to support that one

He was expressing the idea that all his work would be in vain if Plex died. I was simply pointing out that even if such an unlikely thing happened (and the software would still keep working anyways) there were lots of other options

 

So that's just a safety net.

 

So what's next?

 

I am hoping the thread just keeps going forever and keeps jogging my attention until I finally download and try some of the Neural Net based video enhancing code on GitHub. No reason. "Because it is there" (Sir Edmund Hillary when asked why he climbed Mt. Everest)

 

This thread is an adventure and Mt. Everest awaits us!

 

 

[+BudMan MVC]

Its not plex going to die its all of them as the landscape of media consumption changes..  Other than media you have created yourself.. Why have a local copy when you can just stream it?  Why even get a digital copy when you can buy it and just leave it in the cloud so they don't remove it from their listing.

 

Look at how audible works.. You never have to have a local copy, unless you download it to your phone or tablet to listen too while offline..  As soon as you done listening you just delete it off your device because its held in the cloud..

 

Why have a local music library when there a places to just stream a HUGE library of like all music ever..

[Technique]

Because these cloud storage places like to charge you money.

 

Sure the basic deals may be cheap enough, but they still cost.

 

I understand you're not one to care about a few £ going out the window but some are. Currently you buy the song & you own it, job done. 1 time payment. All this streaming eats data and data costs. Cloud storage costs.

[+BudMan MVC]

Buying the 1 song and your done.. Correct... You have the 1 song - have fun listening to that 1 song..

 

Or you can pay small $ amount per month and have millions of songs at your fingertips.

 

Do the math.. How much money you have to spend to have access to such a library?  And if your cheap there is also free access, you just pay with having to listen to ads, etc.

 

[DConnell Member]

9 hours ago, BudMan said:

Buying the 1 song and your done.. Correct... You have the 1 song - have fun listening to that 1 song..

 

Or you can pay small $ amount per month and have millions of songs at your fingertips.

 

Do the math.. How much money you have to spend to have access to such a library?  And if your cheap there is also free access, you just pay with having to listen to ads, etc.

 

Why not both? Streaming for casual listening, purchase the stuff that matters to you. Same thing with video - I feel no need to choose between using Netflix & Amazon and MS Movies and TV and maintaining my own video server. For one thing, my server contains things that have never been officially released and likely never will. Both have a place in my entertainment scheme, and likely will for the foreseeable future. Same thing with DVDs/Blu Rays. I can still pick up the occasional rarity on disc that I can't easily find on any service.

 

Streaming is good for a quick fix, but if it's an album or show or movie that I really like and want to ensure my access to, I'm going to have and keep my own copy of it.

[+BudMan MVC]

Yeah very true -- why I do it

 

But when you can watch in 4k on netflix in 5.1 sound when your copy is a dvd in stereo... Why keep your copy?

 

But its really more just a hobby... And more to show off to friends and family - they have access and watch stuff all the time.. It's like I am netflix..  It was better a few years back before multiple services and everyone is getting into it.. For example you have cbs all access and they have ALL the star treks.. ALL of them...  Sure I have the TOS.. And have the redone versions.... But its just easier to stream their copy.

 

And I have extensive Bogart movies that you for sure can not find online anywhere.. And my Grateful Dead collection is pretty extensive..   He is 10 years late to the party... and still dragging his feat.. And can tell you for sure he doesn't have the stomach for the cost of the hobby hehehe  The hardware needed serve up an ever growing library isn't all that cheap..

[Technique]

On 12/15/2018 at 9:30 AM, BudMan said:

The hardware needed serve up an ever growing library isn't all that cheap..

Care to go in to more detail?

And when you're answering that question, what size library are you pitching at? Obviously if you're trying for the capacity to store every single movie and audio ever released in the history of man that's one thing, compared to what you may currently have plus room for a bit more.

I started buying in around 97, that's when i got my first album, roughly. From there i moved on to more albums, downloading singles, buying movies, so we're looking at 20 years to build the collection i currently have. Like investing, the past is not an indication of the future, but it'll give you a rough estimate to work off.

 

 

 

Anyway i tried out Plex for the first time properly last night. I don't know what can be discussed on this forum so let's just say i 'acquired' a blu-ray disc of a movie. I ripped it to my 2TB WD portable USB drive which is where Plex was pointing to for my movies.

 

Sat down and watched it. Good quality, very good. Got about 39 minutes in and the damn thing just froze.

 

Since this wasn't my disc i went & checked it out - clean. I went and checked out the file on the USB HD to see how it had ripped - played perfectly fine through Windows Media Player. Went back downstairs, rewound the movie & played & it played perfectly fine again with no other hiccup at all in the movie.

[Mindovermaster Global Moderator]

That might be your external turning off. This is normal for an external.

[Technique]

I did wonder if it was something like that. I actually thought of the PC going in to standby mode or something but when i came upstairs it seemed fine. 

Storing on the portable wouldn't be my final choice anyway. I'm only doing this now as i can currently rip blu rays for free, no hassle so i'm getting it done while i can.