Disney+ pulls ‘Dumbo,’ ‘Peter Pan’ other films from children’s profiles over negative depictions

[TsMkLg068426]

10 minutes ago, Dick Montage said:

You are literally triggered by Disney movies and yet call me a “soy boy”. This is utterly amusing.

 

You clearly need to grow up, understand what censorship is and is not, and come back when you’ve got over Dumbo.

 

Wow how triggered you have to be over someone's own opinion about censorship sorry that not everyone is not part of your universe.

 

Triggered by Disney movies?  Nah I could give a crap if they shoved it up Walt Disney's or Mickey's ass.

[Dick Montage]

1 minute ago, TsMkLg068426 said:

 

Wow how triggered you have to be over someone's own opinion about censorship sorry that not everyone is not part of your universe.

 

Triggered by Disney movies?  Nah I could give a crap if they shoved it up Walt Disney's or Mickey's ass.

And yet here you are getting all worked up playing the victim of evil imaginary censorship. Bless your heart...

[PGHammer]

On 14/03/2021 at 11:07, shockz said:

This has to stop. I'm all about respect, inclusion, diversity, but let parents judge these old works on their own and come to their own conclusions with their kids. It's not big brothers business on what parents want their kids to learn, teach in a home, entertainment setting. 

shockz - *all* censorship is about perception shaping; this action by the *woke* community is no different.

 

(I am surprised that they have not come after Amazon Films' "Upload" miniseries yet.)

[techbeck]

11 hours ago, Brandon H said:

That one makes sense IMO; Pepe is the epitome of unwanted touching / rape culture and that's not needed in a cartoon.

Far worse stuff in current animated TV series still being produced. Doubt Pepe had and connection to the rape culture and mistreatment of women has been going on for much much longer. 

[restroom]

I wonder how many people read and understood what is happening here. Initially I was jumping on the "OMG THEY ARE CHANGING THE PAST" brigade, but after reading again, I see they are simply moving the content and allowing parents to make the call on weather their child gets to watch it. This makes sense as in todays world companies are taken to court for silly things and their child watching Dumbo, when the parent feels it was inappropriate could easily end up in a legal case. This way those who are happy for their child to watch it can let them and those who are unhappy can simply not allow them to watch it. Takes the onus of "blame" away from the company and firmly in to the hands of the parents, which is sensible.

 

If they were outright saying they were removing the content and never letting anyone watch it again, that would be a different thing altogether, but this seems like a sensible move to protect the company from future legal proceedings.

[FloatingFatMan]

49 minutes ago, restroom said:

I wonder how many people read and understood what is happening here. Initially I was jumping on the "OMG THEY ARE CHANGING THE PAST" brigade, but after reading again, I see they are simply moving the content and allowing parents to make the call on weather their child gets to watch it. This makes sense as in todays world companies are taken to court for silly things and their child watching Dumbo, when the parent feels it was inappropriate could easily end up in a legal case. This way those who are happy for their child to watch it can let them and those who are unhappy can simply not allow them to watch it. Takes the onus of "blame" away from the company and firmly in to the hands of the parents, which is sensible.

 

If they were outright saying they were removing the content and never letting anyone watch it again, that would be a different thing altogether, but this seems like a sensible move to protect the company from future legal proceedings.

What the REAL problem here is that Disney have to take such steps to protect themselves at all!  I swear there's no personal responsibility any more and were I a judge, I'd just throw any such cases out and hold the idiot bringing it for contempt of humanity...

 

I swear, the internet has turned people into blithering idiots...

[Dick Montage]

On 16/03/2021 at 01:27, techbeck said:

Doubt Pepe had and connection to the rape culture and mistreatment of women has been going on for much much longer. 

Normalising the sexual pestering of women, the attempts at sexual assault (he tries repeatedly to kiss a female against her will), the undermining of the female's values and opinions.  You honestly feel that presenting these as comedic traits to children in no way contributes towards an overall issue?

[FloatingFatMan]

5 minutes ago, Dick Montage said:

Normalising the sexual pestering of women, the attempts at sexual assault (he tries repeatedly to kiss a female against her will), the undermining of the female's values and opinions.  You honestly feel that presenting these as comedic traits to children in no way contributes towards an overall issue?

You've never really watched Pepe, have you?  If you had, you'd know full well there are plenty of incidents where the lady cat does exactly the same to him, and terrifies him in the process.  If anything, the show is trying to teach kids that unwanted attention for either sex is not a good thing.  It just focusses on the girls getting unwanted attention more because well, that's how it is in the real world.

 

 

[Dick Montage]

5 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said:

You've never really watched Pepe, have you?

Yes, I have.  Not to sound like an idiot but I'm quite a fan of classic cartoons (and their merch).  From Fleischer through to the terrible but popular 80s SatAm cartoons.

 

5 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said:

If you had, you'd know full well there are plenty of incidents where the lady cat does exactly the same to him, and terrifies him in the process.

They are to a significantly lesser extent.  They then portray Penelope as the predator and show him up as "all talk no trousers".  Predatory advances are great for kids to watch, right?

 

5 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said:

It just focusses on the girls getting unwanted attention more because well, that's how it is in the real world.

To young children without our analytical thinking, I doubt that their take away allow it to be much more than "Hahahaha, he's trying to kiss the lady"

[FloatingFatMan]

3 minutes ago, Dick Montage said:

To young children without our analytical thinking, I doubt that their take away allow it to be much more than "Hahahaha, he's trying to kiss the lady"

Actually, to my recollection, when I was a kid and watched these cartoons, what I took away from it was, "Hahahaha! He tried to kiss the lady and got splatted! Serves him right! Eeww!"

 

So yeah, definitely taught me to abuse women, for sure. Yup. Totally did.  Absolutely.   

 

If folks want to censor something, how about instead they take a look at modern video games and maybe consider censoring some of them?  I'm pretty sure paying a hooker to give you a BJ in GTA V is totally central to the main story line and doesn't objectify women in the slightest...  

 

[Dick Montage]

1 minute ago, FloatingFatMan said:

Actually, to my recollection, when I was a kid and watched these cartoons, what I took away from it was, "Hahahaha! He tried to kiss the lady and got splatted! Serves him right! Eeww!"

Fair comment, there is very much that sense of justice prevailing and it being presented as "wrong".

 

2 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said:

So yeah, definitely taught me to abuse women, for sure. Yup. Totally did.  Absolutely.   

If you care to trivialise it down to "It teaches them to..." then, quite honestly, you are arguing below the level I know you are capable of.

 

It normalises it.  It presents it within a context of it being "wrong but acceptable and just something women have to deal with".  Maybe if we didn't lumber so much of the ownership on women, then there would be a better take-away.

[FloatingFatMan]

19 minutes ago, Dick Montage said:

It normalises it.  It presents it within a context of it being "wrong but acceptable and just something women have to deal with".  Maybe if we didn't lumber so much of the ownership on women, then there would be a better take-away.

I have a saying I try to live by; never judge something old by the morals of today.  Those cartoons were made in a totally different time, and they were trying, in their own way, to show that it's bad to harass women and something unpleasant is going to happen to you if you do.  Is that how things are handled today? Of course not, but you can't expect 21st century morals from something made in the 1950's era.

 

The mistake here isn't what they did 50+ years ago, it's what we do with what they did.  By censoring it we merely highlight how things were back then instead of learning from it and changing CURRENT entertainments to match CURRENT morals.

 

So sure, take Dumbo off the kids list by default if you must and let parents choose, that's fine. But don't completely cancel something or someone just because you disagree with what they do or say or are. History is there for us to learn from, not ignore.

[Dick Montage]

I don't disagree.  There's a lot from the past that fit in then, that simply doesn't fit in today.  I feel that people who want to sit around and simply lambast the past without any real action are doing nothing more than making noise.  It's almost a form of comedy to look back, maybe even a pat on the pack to those who feel so better about themselves because they act differently now.  And moreover, we can't change the past.  But should we still show Pepe on TV?  In it's current context?  I think not.  We reframe it maybe, present it alongside a comment of what it once represented and how we have changed our stance since.  As noted, I've never once suggested that anything should be removed, whether it be statues of benefactors who made their wealth from the slave trade, a flying elephant or an overly horny skunk - I simply feel that they need to be given the correct context.

[restroom]

2 hours ago, FloatingFatMan said:

What the REAL problem here is that Disney have to take such steps to protect themselves at all!  I swear there's no personal responsibility any more and were I a judge, I'd just throw any such cases out and hold the idiot bringing it for contempt of humanity...

 

I swear, the internet has turned people into blithering idiots...

Oh absolutely. The company should not even need to THINK about protecting itself in any way. Its just that today parents seem to need an excuse for either bad parenting or their child turning out bad regardless of their upbringing. I class myself as a good parent, yet if my son turned out to be a rapist, I wouldn't blame myself as I have taught him right from wrong. I also wouldn't blame cartoons etc. IMO there is no one to blame but himself. He knew right from wrong and chose the wrong path, those are on his back and he has to deal with the fallout from that, not me and certainly not a company who makes cartoons!

 

The thing that I also find crazy is that in SOME cases where the parents ARE to blame, for example if they simply haven't taught their child right from wrong (the type that would hit a teacher because they gave their son bad grades etc.), those are the ones that also go on to blame everything and society for their Childs issues later in life, instead of admitting the fault lays firmly with themselves.

[restroom]

2 hours ago, FloatingFatMan said:

Actually, to my recollection, when I was a kid and watched these cartoons, what I took away from it was, "Hahahaha! He tried to kiss the lady and got splatted! Serves him right! Eeww!"

 

So yeah, definitely taught me to abuse women, for sure. Yup. Totally did.  Absolutely.   

 

If folks want to censor something, how about instead they take a look at modern video games and maybe consider censoring some of them?  I'm pretty sure paying a hooker to give you a BJ in GTA V is totally central to the main story line and doesn't objectify women in the slightest...  

 

That's the thing. I would have no problem with my children watching this. They know right from wrong and they are mentally mature enough to understand that cartoons are slapstick and entertainment value only. They have been taught from an early age the right and wrongs of interaction of any type with other people and no cartoon violence will suddenly make them believe its normal to behave that way.

[techbeck]

4 hours ago, restroom said:

That's the thing. I would have no problem with my children watching this. They know right from wrong and they are mentally mature enough to understand that cartoons are slapstick and entertainment value only. They have been taught from an early age the right and wrongs of interaction of any type with other people and no cartoon violence will suddenly make them believe its normal to behave that way.

Agreed.   Seems like more blaming TV/shows instead of the way a lot of kids are being taught these days.  Shows, games, music, and other media are easy cop outs.  Yes, there are some things that should not exist but these are not the cause of all society problems.

 

 

A lot of kids watch shows like Family Guy where there is a pervert trying to have sex with kids.  And another who locks up women against their will to have  his way with them.   This is just one of the shows currently on TV that is far worse than anything that is under the current spotlight.  Not to mention the award show performances which have half naked people grinding on each other.   And yes, kids watch all of these shows.

 

We also live in a society where now it is not ok for a little boy to hug a girl.   I mean, an innocent hug from a little boy who knows nothing about sex/assault and just wants to be nice is no punishable. 

[Dick Montage]

17 hours ago, techbeck said:

Shows, games, music, and other media are easy cop outs.

They absolutely are.  They can often be used as scapegoats for society's ills - sometimes rightly and sometimes wrongly.  But also we live in a time when they are surrogate parents also - and that (IMO) is a major part of the issue.

 

17 hours ago, techbeck said:

And yes, kids watch all of these shows.

Which air at a time when kids probably shouldn't be watching them - but hey when parents don't oversee their kids viewing, what are you gonna do.  Plus, in fairness - I can go to any reputable news source and access the video the Grammy performance, so the argument of time-related watersheds is one from a previous era now.

 

17 hours ago, techbeck said:

We also live in a society where now it is not ok for a little boy to hug a girl.

No.  No we really don't.  That's utter nonsense based upon hyperbole used to overstate a situation.

[FloatingFatMan]

On 19/03/2021 at 18:42, techbeck said:

We also live in a society where now it is not ok for a little boy to hug a girl.   I mean, an innocent hug from a little boy who knows nothing about sex/assault and just wants to be nice is no punishable. 

 

17 hours ago, Dick Montage said:

No.  No we really don't.  That's utter nonsense based upon hyperbole used to overstate a situation.

 

True story time.  Many years ago, when my kids were still young, my daughter was upset about something (I forget why) at the end of school.  My daughter was 6 at the time and she was in tears, so my son, who was 9, gave her a hug and a kiss on the forehead to calm her down.  A truly touching moment, especially from a boy with mild aspergers.

 

The next day I was called in to the school office.  Apparently a parent had complained about a boy sexually assaulting a little girl and my kids had been identified.  My SON, comforted his upset little SISTER, and that was called sexual assault...  I had to walk out of the room before I punched someone.

 

It took over a month of utter stupidity and repeated meetings before the school realised they were brainless morons and apologised.  I moved both my kids to another school.

 

So yes, we really DO live in a world where stupid stuff like this happens...

[Dick Montage]

3 hours ago, FloatingFatMan said:

 

 

True story time.  Many years ago, when my kids were still young, my daughter was upset about something (I forget why) at the end of school.  My daughter was 6 at the time and she was in tears, so my son, who was 9, gave her a hug and a kiss on the forehead to calm her down.  A truly touching moment, especially from a boy with mild aspergers.

 

The next day I was called in to the school office.  Apparently a parent had complained about a boy sexually assaulting a little girl and my kids had been identified.  My SON, comforted his upset little SISTER, and that was called sexual assault...  I had to walk out of the room before I punched someone.

 

It took over a month of utter stupidity and repeated meetings before the school realised they were brainless morons and apologised.  I moved both my kids to another school.

 

So yes, we really DO live in a world where stupid stuff like this happens...

It happens but let’s not make out like it’s absolutely commonplace. As you say yourself, it is through idiotic decision making and I would have torn whoever sexualised that situation a new one.

 

I hope your children were not exposed to this utter bastardisation of what showing care and affection is

[restroom]

Never mind.

Edited March 22, 2021 by restroom
No reason