insanekiwi Posted October 22, 2005 Share Posted October 22, 2005 one of my friends uses a microsoft natural keyboard. imo it's not just ugly, it's totally unuseable to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaguratuS Posted October 22, 2005 Author Share Posted October 22, 2005 one of my friends uses a microsoft natural keyboard. imo it's not just ugly, it's totally unuseable to me. 586708922[/snapback] It's one of those things that you have to get used to. I initially hated them, but I was stuck with one for a few months. After that I just couldn't go back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SourDieseL NYC Posted October 28, 2005 Share Posted October 28, 2005 It's one of those things that you have to get used to. I initially hated them, but I was stuck with one for a few months. After that I just couldn't go back. 586710857[/snapback] I agree - once I've gone ergo, I never would go back. Granted at work i use a regular keyboard which I've requested an ergo since I do heavy programming, html coding, access scripting, oracle scripting, literally the whole nine yards so I need to have a ergo keyboard or my forearms begin to hurt (carpal tunnel anyone?) Anyways, back to the 4000, I took off the reverse tilt and its perfectly fine. I actually enjoy the reverse tilt based on the seating posture. Usually when I'm designing I sit up in my chair with the chair tilt locked. Most designers do as they like to be ontop onpoint with their graphics and coding. This helps me keep focused as to not slouch and cause me to be off pixels when making images. So I guess posture/seating position plays an important role as to how this keyboard is used. Granted when I'm leaning back it's easier to tilt towards me still keeping the same wrist resting position. Overall, it's a keyboard you have to get used to, once you are used to it, you love it. It's also a deterrent from those pesty visitors who want to use your computer so they can "check their email" which pretty much means i'll download all the spyware on your computer because i'm trying to get the latest mp3 from some random www.freemp3s.com type of deal. Maybe i'm just anal about it, but I hate it when people use my computer. Go-Go-Ergonomic-Keyboard-Deterrent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaguratuS Posted October 28, 2005 Author Share Posted October 28, 2005 I agree - once I've gone ergo, I never would go back. Granted at work i use a regular keyboard which I've requested an ergo since I do heavy programming, html coding, access scripting, oracle scripting, literally the whole nine yards so I need to have a ergo keyboard or my forearms begin to hurt (carpal tunnel anyone?) Anyways, back to the 4000, I took off the reverse tilt and its perfectly fine. I actually enjoy the reverse tilt based on the seating posture. Usually when I'm designing I sit up in my chair with the chair tilt locked. Most designers do as they like to be ontop onpoint with their graphics and coding. This helps me keep focused as to not slouch and cause me to be off pixels when making images. So I guess posture/seating position plays an important role as to how this keyboard is used. Granted when I'm leaning back it's easier to tilt towards me still keeping the same wrist resting position. Overall, it's a keyboard you have to get used to, once you are used to it, you love it. It's also a deterrent from those pesty visitors who want to use your computer so they can "check their email" which pretty much means i'll download all the spyware on your computer because i'm trying to get the latest mp3 from some random www.freemp3s.com type of deal. Maybe i'm just anal about it, but I hate it when people use my computer. Go-Go-Ergonomic-Keyboard-Deterrent 586737226[/snapback] Hah, that couldn't be more true. I still have the reverse tilt on mine, and everyone who's come over and used it has complained. I tried taking the reverse tilt off again, but it's another one of those things you get used to. Hopefully we'll see more of this in future ergonomic keyboards (Y) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Des429 Posted October 28, 2005 Share Posted October 28, 2005 if you use these ergonomic keyboards, does it help with your typing (faster typing, perhaps less errors)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaguratuS Posted October 29, 2005 Author Share Posted October 29, 2005 if you use these ergonomic keyboards, does it help with your typing (faster typing, perhaps less errors)? 586738054[/snapback] From personal experience, I'd have to say it does. It just makes it so much more comfortable, but I'm sure everyone will have mixed results. When switching from a flat to an ergonomic, or even an ergonomic to this one, your error rate will go up a significant amount until you get used to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hidea Posted October 29, 2005 Share Posted October 29, 2005 I just bought this baby today, and I don't find the spacebar to be troublesome, I love how it's very quite, and it's just a lot better than the previous natural keyboards, this one is definitely the best. the pads are awesome. it's very comfy to type with this baby. I love every single aspect about this keyboard. maybe not hte fact that they don't supply you with extra PS/2-2-USB adapter, but that's fine. I had troubles though.. I can't seem to have this Keyobard and my MX1000 on PS2, or even having this keyboard and MX1000 both on PS2. The Problem is: When I use the 4000 on a USB port and the MX1000 on PS2, the MX1000 won't respond at all.... HOWEVER, if I use the old multimedia KB on PS2 with MX1000 on PS2 as well, it'll work fine. I tried putting both the 4000 and MX1000 on PS2, it won't work for either. But my MX1000 becomes VERY jumpy on USB... dammit.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d3nuo Posted October 29, 2005 Share Posted October 29, 2005 I've been using this kboard for over 2 weeks, and I must say it's by far the best keyboard I've ever used. I've had the Microsoft Natural Multimedia keyboard for over a year and a half (maybe longer, i can't remember exactly) and it served me very well. This kboard blows that one out of the water. the 4000 is so quiet, so comfortable, so good looking, oh, and it's comfortable :). I thought natural keyboards were a stupid invention with the natural keybard elite came out like 4 or 5 years ago. My best friend got the natural keyboard pro for Christmas when we were sophomores in High school, and I would go to his house to play Midtown Madness. I thought the kb looked, and felt odd. However, after many IM sessions on his computer, I had to get one. Sure it took some getting used to, but after having gotten used to it, I can type faster, my hands are a lot more comfortable (wrists/arms too). Straight keyboards are just useless now, they're very uncomfortable especially with big hands and long fingers like I've got. This keyboard is amazing! The spacebar posed a bit of a problem when i first started typing on it, but i soon got used to it, and now it's a dream of a keyboard. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yvo Posted October 29, 2005 Share Posted October 29, 2005 I just wish they would make a nice ergo keyboard for the Mac. I know about the ones out there but the Natural Keyboard is by far more surperior. Sure I can hookup a Natural Keyboard (and nothing is stopping me) but... I'd rather have Mac keys on it instead of a Windows / start button. Other then that, this might make a great Xmas gift for the parents. The loud space bar... that has been an issue since the Natural Keyboard elite came out in 97/98. It is always the loudest key on the board. Even in the Natural Multimedia KB my Windows box has it is loud... not to mention that after about a good year to 18 months of usage it gets this annoy squeek when you press on it. This is due to the metal hinges attached to the bottom of the spacebar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hidea Posted October 29, 2005 Share Posted October 29, 2005 Yea, you just have to get used to it a little bit, if you are a previous user of a natrual keyboard, it'll be much easier for you to get used to it, since you already have some sort of a muscle memory intact to your brain.. once you're adjusted to the keyboard, it's a dream keyboard. it's quite, the keys feel nice, like an apple keyboard. It's awesome. THat's how the keys feel like, apple's keyboard. It'd be better if the damn Keyboard has USB ports/extensions though :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ienhz Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 damn if only it was wireless! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galley Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 I have read elsewhere that the 4000 does not support PS/2 connections. WTF? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaguratuS Posted October 30, 2005 Author Share Posted October 30, 2005 Nope, it doesn't. I don't see why it's an issue though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamNeeds Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 Oh-my-god.... :o Thats...well, messed! Like i always say, to each is their own. I'm just one of the ones who thinks that keyboard is completly wrong!! :pinch: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blash Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 does anyone know about Saguratus' mod? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustyzippo Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I just bought one of these off newegg today for $42. It comes with a free optical mouse though so I don't feel too bad spending the money. I'll post here when I've tried it out (never used anything other than standard keyboard my whole life). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibwar Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I am a user of the 4000 for a few weeks now, and I love it. Sure there is the learning curve from moving from flat to natural, and from older naturals to this one, but give it time and you'll be typing away for hours and feeling great! I personally like the reverse tilt on the keyboard, because it puts your wrists in their natural position (you can cheat and rest them even when typing). My spacebar is actually quite quiet, which is odd for the natural line. I do miss the stop key, and the fact that you can't really remap any of the keys, and I have yet to use the zoom slider... I wish I could change it to act like a scroll wheel (I had the Desktop Elite Wireless set, used the wheel all of the time). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigGiantHead Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Thanks for the reviews guys. This keyboard has been on my buy list for a while now. Will be getting one soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blash Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 well i think the problem isn't the spacebar loudness nor the learnin curve (i can type fast even if i have never used ergo keyb.s)... but the keys' stiffness...they are too difficult to press compared to other keyb.s , expecially the spacebar....i was used to graze it with the side of the thumb, now i have to press it quite hard :( too bad, i think i'll go back to the G15 if i don't find a solution Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oceanseleven Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I use this same keyboard at home and work. I don't think I could go back to using a regular keyboard anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaguratuS Posted March 1, 2006 Author Share Posted March 1, 2006 Here's an update after ~5 months of use Well, only one thing I can say. If you use this thing, forget about using anything else. I can no longer comfortably use a natural keyboard that doesn't have the wrist lifts, let alone a flat one. Over time it's actually improved my speed / accuracy as well, and the material seems to be doing quite fine, with some minor normal wear on the spacebar. The scroller / zoom tab in the middle is worthless, there's no use for it. Likewise, the back/forward keys do not send standard keycodes, and so they are unusable under linux. Similarly, there are issues with the other extended buttons, however a few of the important ones such as volume, play/pause, and calculator do in fact work. Over time the spacebar becomes easier to use, however I've noticed a few high-traffic keys (such as w) require to be fully pressed to work properly. Overall, I'd still stick by my original decision, this is an exceptional keyboard. If you do end up purchasing it, the one thing I would STRONGLY advise is to use the wrist lifter that's included. It's hard to work with at first, but stick with it. It's much like the changeover from a flat to a natural keyboard - once you get used to it, you won't want to go back. On a side note, my job requires me to be on the computer actively working for 12-14 hours a day programming. Any additional free time is game time. My 5 months of use will equate to about 4 years of use for the average user, and this keyboard is showing no signs of letting up. Only typical wear and tear can be seen, such as slightly noisier keys, and a loss of texture on the spacebar. The padded surface is still doing great, and seems to be staying clean. Time to get back to fragging. Buy it, it'll be the best $40 you have ever spent on a keyboard. $35 OEM via newegg: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?...N82E16823109159 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blash Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Saguratus, i sent you a pm and email, but you didn't reply :( can you tell me please how did you modded the spacebar to make it less stiff? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaguratuS Posted March 1, 2006 Author Share Posted March 1, 2006 Saguratus, i sent you a pm and email, but you didn't reply :( can you tell me please how did you modded the spacebar to make it less stiff? thanks Pop the spacebar, apply some oil / grease. Sorry, thought I had covered that before. Keep in mind that doing this won't last forever, in fact it's a rather short period of time. The best method is to just use your keyboard, it'll eventually wear down enough that it's no longer an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blash Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 i hope so, thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustyzippo Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 How are these for gaming? Also how are the natural multimedia for gaming? The only thing I coud find wrong with it is that it will not let me hold more than 3 keys down at the same time!!!!!!!!! I noticed this right away when I was trying to fly a jet in BF2 (I use the keyboard only). My stupid original gateway keyboard will let me hold down 4 keys!!!!!!! Anyone else notice this??? I'm pretty sure this is a hardware issue, so i doubt there is any way to change it. :( guess ill just have to switch back and forth for bf2! :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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