xxpor Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 I have a 2003 server called 'server2003'. Its the DC for the domain 'homeserver23.net'. The domain shows up in my network places, and so do all of the computers that are members of the domain, except for the actual server. On computers on the domain, typing \\server2003 works. For computers on the same network and subnet, but on a workgroup, not even typing \\server2003 works. How do I fix this? Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BudMan MVC Posted November 13, 2006 MVC Share Posted November 13, 2006 Well you fix it by having some basic understanding of how the browse service works.. Are you running WINS? http://technet2.microsoft.com/WindowsServe...3.mspx?mfr=true How Computer Browser Service Works Computer Browser service is a networking technology used by Windows-based computers to collect, distribute, and obtain browse lists, which are collections of information about workgroups, domains, and the computers within them. The service is essential for computers running Windows 98 or Windows Millennium Edition to browse for resources and it is required in Windows Server 2003, Windows XP, and Windows 2000 for using applications such as My Network Places, Windows Explorer, and the net view command. Computer Browser service typically uses connectionless server broadcasts to communicate between nodes. Registration, announcements, and browser elections are performed by the service to provide the network with a list of available resources. Computer Browser service operates ideally in a Windows network where several computers play various browser roles. Together, these browser roles form the browser system. http://www.microsoft.com/technet/itsolutio...pfund_appc.mspx TCP/IP Fundamentals for Microsoft Windows Appendix C ? Computer Browser Service Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588044010 Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxpor Posted November 13, 2006 Author Share Posted November 13, 2006 i only have it installed Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588044281 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BudMan MVC Posted November 13, 2006 MVC Share Posted November 13, 2006 (edited) Only have what installed? WINS? Are you pointing any machines to it? ;) Like I said -- you can fix your issue by having some basic understanding of how it works, and then setting up your system(s) to use it correctly ;) When you say workgroup machines can not use \\servername ? Are they not on the same subnet as the server? Read over the documents I linked too - they will give you an understanding of how computer browsing works - once you understand the basics.. You will most likely see why some machines are not working quite clearly.. Normally to browse across subnets - wins is used, so that the different browse masters can find each other, etc.. Its all talked about in the docs I linked too. edit: Once you have the basics down - here this can be helpful info http://support.microsoft.com/kb/188305/ Troubleshooting the Microsoft Computer Browser Service Edited November 13, 2006 by BudMan Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588044317 Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxpor Posted November 13, 2006 Author Share Posted November 13, 2006 no they are all on the same subnet. Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588044392 Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethevans1986 Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 Wouldn't it actually be a DNS thing Budman? I would of thought it would be. ChocIST Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588044973 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BudMan MVC Posted November 14, 2006 MVC Share Posted November 14, 2006 network neighborhood has nothing to do with dns ;) Its a stupid browse function that really has has nothing to do with anything.. Not required for much of anything -- except for "browsing" which is pointless IMHO.. why would you not know the FQDN of your own servers? Or the server your trying to access? But if you want it to work - you need to understand how it does, or it will always just be magic - which it clearly is not ;) I love to help - but when you try and help and get responses -- I only have it installed? they are on the same subnet? What is? Its like pulling teeth around to get even the smallest tidbits of info to work with. It is very difficult! If you want netbios name resolution to work, then you should run WINS.. Passing info with broadcasts, not even knowing which computer will maintain the list, until after elections have been held, etc.. is not a very reliable method of mainting name resolution ;) then if for some reason a machine has not been told to NOT maintain the list, and it does not hear from the browse master, etc.. it will make its self the browse master - and then announce this on the network, etc.. etc.. etc.. Or better yet - when your running wins, and a laptop has been off the network -- and then comes on and registers itself in the wins database as the browse master!! Its really a joke of a system - and you will always have issues with it unless you take some steps to make sure it runs as smooth as it can within its limitations. Here is one of my fav quotes from one of the MS documents http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details...;displaylang=en Computer Browsing for SOHO Networks with Microsoft Windows Limitations of Computer Browsing The Computer Browsing service is designed to provide an updated list of workgroups and the computers within them by using a minimum of network and computer resources. The communication that the Computer Browser service uses has the following characteristics: • Periodic Messages sent to maintain the browse list are sent periodically, typically every 12 or 15 minutes. This is done to keep the network resources required for computer browsing low. • Unreliable Messages typically exchanged are sent as single messages, without first establishing a connection or session for communication. This is done to keep the local computer resources required for computer browsing low. • Unsynchronized The browse list that is stored on multiple browse servers in a workgroup can become unsynchronized. Therefore, a browse client that uses one browse server can display a different set of computers and workgroups than a browse client that uses another browse server. Because the communication between servers, Master Browse Servers, Backup Browse Servers is periodic, unreliable, and synchronized, the Computer Browsing service does not provide real-time updating of the browse list. Therefore, the display of computers and workgroups on your SOHO network using My Network Places or Network Neighborhood does not necessarily reflect the actual set of workgroups and computers on your network. Does any of that sound like something you want want to use in finding machines on your network ;) If you want/need netbios name resolution -- atleast take some time and set it up correctly.. Use WINS if available -- samba can act as a wins server even.. You dont just turn on a bunch of machines and then wonder why they can not find each other with netbios ;) Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588045310 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 So you're telling me that even though I have not configured WINS on my 2003 server, it's running? :blink: Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588046593 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BudMan MVC Posted November 14, 2006 MVC Share Posted November 14, 2006 Did you install WINS? Then yes it would be running - but if you did not configure it - ie machines to point to it, then its kind of pointless. ;) Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588046920 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 Did you install WINS? Then yes it would be running - but if you did not configure it - ie machines to point to it, then its kind of pointless. ;) Right, but all of my stuff works, and you're telling him that his stuff doesn't because of WINS (or the lack of it). Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588046947 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BudMan MVC Posted November 14, 2006 MVC Share Posted November 14, 2006 (edited) Right, but all of my stuff works, and you're telling him that his stuff doesn't because of WINS (or the lack of it). Where did I say that? Are you using browsing? Do you have machine on an off the network all the time? Do you have multiple segments?Like I said browsing is not really used for much of anything. If you type \\computername -- your machine could always just broadcast for it! And find it -- the browse list is not required, etc.. But when you look at your net hood, and wonder why machines are not there - or why machines might be listed as being there - when they are not.. Then you need to understand how it works. If you having problems with "computer browsing" - you need to understand how it works and its limitations, so you can figure out why something is not showing up. WINS is a much more reliable way to maintain netbios name resolution if you need it - but where did I say it was "required"??? For all I know his server is running wins.. But his workgroup machines are not talking to it.. So how would his Domain Master browser which is using wins know to exchange info with the workgroup browsemaster? what is the name of the workgroup? Is it the same as the domains netbios name? etc.. etc.. There all kinds of things that could be the issue.. I do not recall ever saying that 1 specific thing was his problem?? Edited November 14, 2006 by BudMan Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588046962 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 Where did I say that? See below. His problem was finding his server in My Network Places. I have a 2003 server called 'server2003'. Its the DC for the domain 'homeserver23.net'. The domain shows up in my network places, and so do all of the computers that are members of the domain, except for the actual server. On computers on the domain, typing \\server2003 works. For computers on the same network and subnet, but on a workgroup, not even typing \\server2003 works. How do I fix this? Well you fix it by having some basic understanding of how the browse service works.. Are you running WINS? Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588047412 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BudMan MVC Posted November 15, 2006 MVC Share Posted November 15, 2006 Um "asking" if he is runnings WINS is not telling him to run it! ;) As I was saying -- he fixes it by having an understanding of how it works, ie the links I provided to info on how it does! Nowhere did I say his problem would go away if he was running wins.. I do not see where you got the idea that my request for more info on his setup to be a suggestion on how to fix his problem? I highly doubt his setup is the same as yours.. We have no idea what your even doing, or him for that matter - so to say your not having problems and you do not run wins, what does that have to do with his setup or his problem? Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588048803 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 I thought you were telling him that WINS was the issue. It sure sounded like that. Since we agree it's not, what else could it be? Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588050475 Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbba Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 I have a 2003 server called 'server2003'. Its the DC for the domain 'homeserver23.net'. The domain shows up in my network places, and so do all of the computers that are members of the domain, except for the actual server. On computers on the domain, typing \\server2003 works. For computers on the same network and subnet, but on a workgroup, not even typing \\server2003 works. How do I fix this? Ok, given the general consensus that browsing through the network neighbourhood is unreliable, is it important that you resolve this or is it possible that you could try a different means (like run \\servername)? for the workgroup computers, what error message do you get? can you ping the server by name and ip? Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588050772 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BudMan MVC Posted November 16, 2006 MVC Share Posted November 16, 2006 Since we agree it's not, what else could it be? Please do not put words in my mouth.. Part of his problem(s) could very will be wins related.. Is he running it or not?? That is the question.I was only pointing out that wins is more reliable than a browselist when it comes to netbios name resoution, etc. And trying to get some info on his setup. "i only have it installed" I really have no idea what this is suppose to mean?? What would be the point of installing it - if your not using it? Which machines are pointing to it, if any? So yes it could very well be "part" of his issue(s). To be honest, he has not given us boo as far as info to his problem.. "on a workgroup, not even typing \\server2003 works." What does "works" mean? Does it not resolve, or does he get an access denied? Why would he think that a workgoup machine should have access to view the shares on a domain machine - how did he set the permissions? As bobbba has requested - lets get some info to work with. What error does he get when he types \\servername from a workgroup machine? Does he get no network provider accepted the given network path, access denied, does it request his username and password, what? What about net view \\servername - what error does this give? If any? From what machine(s) was he even looking at the browselist from? What part of periodic and unreliable and unsynchronized did you not get from the info I have posted and linked to about browselists? It is quite possible for machines to be missing from the list! Or maybe they just have not been put in yet - which copy of the browselist is he looking at? From the master browser, from a backup browser? etc.. etc.. etc.. Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588053130 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted November 16, 2006 Share Posted November 16, 2006 Please do not put words in my mouth That wasn't my intention, sorry. Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588053262 Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BudMan MVC Posted November 16, 2006 MVC Share Posted November 16, 2006 No problem -- It just gets frustrating not having any info.. They stop in maybe drop in a couple word response (bringing up just more questions than giving anything to work with) -- and then never come back, and leave the ones willing to help to discuss an issue with really nothing to go on ;) We could put theories out there all day as to what his problem is.. Top of my list is PEBKAC currently ;) But without some details -- there is not much more anyone can do but point to info about how the process works.. But while we are waiting - what do you think it might be? ;) Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588054123 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted November 16, 2006 Share Posted November 16, 2006 We could put theories out there all day as to what his problem is.. Top of my list is PEBKAC currently ;) +1 Link to comment https://www.neowin.net/forum/topic/512080-dc-not-visible-in-my-network-places/#findComment-588054659 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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