Illegal Codecs Put Me Off Linux

By markwolfe
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Grand Master

ichi

Posted
Posted
l to freely break the law or not; it doesn't alter the fact that you ARE breaking the law, and it's one of the reasons (a minor one admittedly) Linux will STAY in the domain of the geek.

So your theory is that linux will "remain geek" (in part) because you must go illegal to install some codecs, right? How about this: you can BUY linux, getting both the codecs and the license to use them. Or, as an alternative, you can get linux for free and adquire a license for the codecs (did you see the link I posted some replies ago?).

As legal as it gets.

There goes your theory ;)

BTW your story about "Boabob Linux" has nothing to do with what h3xis was talking about:

I could probably go to the copyright holders of MP3 or any other proprietary format and tell them I'm using it on Linux and nothing would happen

He is using the codec, but it didn't came with the distro.

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kingroach

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There is many crimes you can do without being caught.. but that doesnt makes it right.. I can download patched OSX and install it in my computer, I can also download OEM patched vista dvd and no body would know.. BUt talking about such things is now allowed in teh forum.. just because ccreators of the codecs doesnt send every website that has information about how to get the files a legal warning or they dont have army of lawyers like MS or Apple; doesnt make installing them "less illegal".

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Grand Master

ichi

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Is this codec/patent milarky a US only issue? Do the patents and laws apply to other countries too?

According wikipedia (so it might not be 100% realiable nor complete) software patents are valid in US and Japan. I guess patent owners might not be the same in both countries though, specially considering the Japanese "policies" regarding anything coming from abroad.

Also I have no clue about what are the requirements to file a patent in Japan (tbh I was just to lazy to read the info linked from wikipedia).

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Grand Master

markwolfe Veteran

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...

Whether you think it's cool to freely break the law or not; it doesn't alter the fact that you ARE breaking the law, and it's one of the reasons (a minor one admittedly) Linux will STAY in the domain of the geek.

...

Both you and ScottKin both seem to think that playing MP3 in Linux is illegal. Or playing DVDs with DeCSS.

I have clearly posted a link to the MP3 Licensing site that states that they freely allow use for home users. And DeCSS has been in court before with the US entertainment industry taking "DVD Jon" to court repeatedly to try to get DeCSS found illegal in court. Every time they did this, they lost. They would appeal and lose again. They gave up. There has not been a single court ruling on this that states using DeCSS in Linux is illegal, and several that state is is perfectly OK.

So, where do you two get your sources of information from?

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Grand Master

LTD

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Both you and ScottKin both seem to think that playing MP3 in Linux is illegal. Or playing DVDs with DeCSS.

I have clearly posted a link to the MP3 Licensing site that states that they freely allow use for home users. And DeCSS has been in court before with the US entertainment industry taking "DVD Jon" to court repeatedly to try to get DeCSS found illegal in court. Every time they did this, they lost. They would appeal and lose again. They gave up. There has not been a single court ruling on this that states using DeCSS in Linux is illegal, and several that state is is perfectly OK.

So, where do you two get your sources of information from?

Excellent post, mark

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Grand Master

FloatingFatMan

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If you'd bothered to read ALL of my post, instead of just the words you wanted to, you know full well I said they don't and won't bother to go after home users. What I said was if a Linux DISTRO included illegal codecs, they WOULD go after them; as it's a business distributing it without a license.

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Grand Master

markwolfe Veteran

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If you'd bothered to read ALL of my post, instead of just the words you wanted to, you know full well I said they don't and won't bother to go after home users. What I said was if a Linux DISTRO included illegal codecs, they WOULD go after them; as it's a business distributing it without a license.

I did read your whole quote, I just cut out the relevant bit. Here it is, in all its glory:

Of course they're not interested in individual users; BUT, if someone came along and told them, "I installed Boabob Linux* and it came with your codecs for free", and on checking they find the makers of Boabob Linux don't have a license, they'd be phoning their lawyers toot sweet.

Whether you think it's cool to freely break the law or not; it doesn't alter the fact that you ARE breaking the law, and it's one of the reasons (a minor one admittedly) Linux will STAY in the domain of the geek.

Oh, and to the 12 year olds who say "He won't get laided until he'd 90", grow up and learn English.

(* Not a real Linux distro!)

Now, please tell me why you insist that h3xis is "breaking the law", when he isn't.

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Grand Master

FloatingFatMan

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By using an illegally distrubuted product, he IS breaking the law; but the copyright owners aren't interested in him.

In my example, it's the fictional makers of "Boabob Linux" who they'd go after, for distributing unlicensed codecs. The owners of the license would never bother going after the individual user as it's not cost effective, but someone selling a product? Oh yeah...

And because of that, most Linux distros don't include licensed codecs, as they would push the price to a level which could make selling their distro's problematic. And when it comes to OS's that can't playback your media, well... Windows XP N sold REALLY well, didn't it?

But as I said, it's only a MINOR reason why Linux struggles to get beyond the geek market.

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Grand Master

markwolfe Veteran

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Once again, I must point out that MP3 is not illegal. I even linked to the Thomson Fraunhofer site regarding the license.

Get it? MP3 is not illegal, despite your ill-informed opinion that it is.

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Grand Master

Malisk

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I don't understand people like this. I guess it's great that he wants to be a good boy and not install "illegal" software on his machine but come on, nobody is going to know.

That's not the way Linux supporters that bash people pirating Windows use to argue. :p

I guess it depends on which side one is on, regarding whoms license it's OK to break.

Personally, I recommend using "legal" Linux distributions and libraries, and if you need other stuff, just do that on Windows or OS X, or wherever it works legally. Otherwise you can just as well throw the argument of using Linux as a "legal but free" method out the window as it would turn hypocritical.

And no (looks above), decoding mp3 as in players without paying them money is not illegal. ;)

Edited by Jugalator
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DreadBoat89

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for all you guys that are attacking the article's writer... ever heard about somebody with a conscience? >.> he clearly doesn't feel good when he uses illegal stuff. by the comments you people are posting, it makes me wonder if you have one.

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Grand Master

FloatingFatMan

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Once again, I must point out that MP3 is not illegal. I even linked to the Thomson Fraunhofer site regarding the license.

Get it? MP3 is not illegal, despite your ill-informed opinion that it is.

Did I say MP3? Might want to check my posts again, I said codecs. That could mean any number of licensed codecs that people install illegal version of. Such as MPEG2 for example.

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Grand Master

CaKeY

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Did I say MP3? Might want to check my posts again, I said codecs. That could mean any number of licensed codecs that people install illegal version of. Such as MPEG2 for example.

And installing an "illegal version" of a codec on Linux would be different than someone installing an "illegal version" of a codec on windows how... ?

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Grand Master

markwolfe Veteran

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for all you guys that are attacking the article's writer... ever heard about somebody with a conscience? >.> he clearly doesn't feel good when he uses illegal stuff. by the comments you people are posting, it makes me wonder if you have one.
The comment I have for the article writer is to learn a bit more on the subjects he writes about. MP3 is not illegal. CSS decryption is also not illegal. Yet he states that they are.
Did I say MP3? Might want to check my posts again, I said codecs. That could mean any number of licensed codecs that people install illegal version of. Such as MPEG2 for example.
Having short-term memory problems? h3xis was specific in saying MPEG Layer 3 (MP3) codecs. You were just as specific when you stated he was breaking the law. Please take your advice and re-read your own post.
Won't somebody PLEASE think of the copywrite holders!!!

:rolleyes:

It would be patent holders here. Or 'trade secret' in the case of CSS. Copyright is on the code, for example LAME (which is an Open Source collection that is capable, among other things, encoding and decoding MP3) is independently-written code so there is no "copyright" issue, but since it works with MP3, the "patent" issue would be involved. However, they freely allow home use of the algorithm. Hence, no issue. Hence, not illegal.
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