HDDVD group cancel CES press conference in wake of Warner announcement

[low]

This move is very odd to me. I don't understand how a $178 player with 10 free movies is being beaten over Blu-Ray's almost double price.

think about this, it is peer pressure, blu-ray is "cool" HD-DVD is not. People follow trends.

[AlphaPrime]

Since we'll never know that for sure (because of the payouts), I've been questioning why you're so sure of that. We didn't actually see anything with the PS3 and Blu-ray, at least nothing that wasn't tainted. We;ll never know.

Because at launch there was very little price difference between the PS3 and HD-DVD players, and within 6 months, many of the studios would have decided on which format they'd want to support. Standalone HD-DVD players at those prices back then would have hardly got enough people to buy them to actually match and even go past movies sales brought on by the PS3. To think otherwise, well.. Now if Toshiba had their players down to $199 by the time PS3 launched it could have been a different story. But they didn't, here we are now, everyone in this format war was offered money, the sales happened how they did. Maybe HD-DVD owners should have bought more discs.

[ANova]

Eh, I have no interest in either formats. The studios can take their high prices and shove it.

[Jason S. Global Moderator]

think about this, it is peer pressure, blu-ray is "cool" HD-DVD is not. People follow trends.

youre right.

im still baffled by the decision... i realize HD DVD didnt have better sales and all, but from a cost standpoint... HD DVD is cheaper. i just dont get why people want to pay MORE for a very similar product.

[SnowRanger13]

Thank god the format war seems to be coming to an end. Blu-ray is winning because of PS3, no other reason. I'm a Blu-ray supporter but I admit it only is winning because of PS3. More dedicated HD-DVD players are sold then Blu-ray but because PS3 plays Blu-ray and there is almost 9million PS3's sold now there are more Blu-ray movies sold then HD-DVD movies.

Those saying PS3 isn't selling well, get over it. It is now. It's almost sold 9million, yes Xbox360 is killing it with 17.7million sold but it was out a whole year before. Lets not get into a console war the point is PS3 is selling decent numbers and is helping push Blu-ray.

Your not forced to pay 4x for a Blu-ray Player, wait and the prices will drop its bound to happen. No one is forcing you to buy one now while prices start at $399.

Edited January 6, 2008 by cloudstrife13

[Joel]

Because at launch there was very little price difference between the PS3 and HD-DVD players, and within 6 months, many of the studios would have decided on which format they'd want to support.

At launch, BD cheapest players were twice the price of the cheapest HD-DVD players. It took the PS3 to bring a cheaper BD player to the market.

[XerXis]

i aint over till the fat lady sings ;)

[Xero]

Honestly I think HD-DVD can still win if attacks Blu-Ray on all fronts, Games, Movies, and Computer. Make the HD DVD Rom standard like the DVD-ROM. Sell HD DVD Roms for 100 bucks, and burners for 150.

Just My Idea, Seeing how This format over isnt just over movies.. I would hope.

It wouldn't make a difference, consumers aren't going to buy a drive just because its cheap when 3/4 of the market is leaning towards another format that won't work with those drives. Not to mention HDDVD is hands down the worst format when looking at computer only use. And they can't do anything regarding games because Microsoft tried to save a buck by not including an HD player by default, they can't all of a sudden start making HDDVD games, alienating the majority of its users. I suppose its a good move for them as HDDVD is about to hit rock bottom this year.

Only thing would be nice is if Blu Ray players dropped in price. I need to get one for my Dad so he stops stealing my damn PS3.

[AlphaPrime]

At launch, BD cheapest players were twice the price of the cheapest HD-DVD players. It took the PS3 to bring a cheaper BD player to the market.

I was referring to the PS3 launch. Hence, you know, including the word PS3 in that sentence. ;) Before PS3, HD movie sales across the board were basically nothing, which is the reason why BR took over in only a matter of weeks.

Also, this is a good idea:

"Speaking of doing what's right for consumers, we have an idea. Warner and the rest of the Blu-ray Disc Association should take the high road in the weeks ahead, and offer some kind of deal to HD-DVD enthusiasts as a nice gesture. It could be some kind of arrangement that allows them to exchange a couple of their HD-DVD movies for Blu-ray versions of the same title, or some kind discount on Blu-ray hardware and software. Think of it as a peace offering - a way to welcome HD-DVD consumers into the Blu-ray fold. It's just a thought we had, but we think it's something the BDA should seriously consider, to help put all this format war foolishness - and the acrimony it's inspired online - behind us."

http://www.thedigitalbits.com/index.html#mytwocents

[low]

I have had my ps3 for about nearly 2 months, i do not own 1 blu-ray title, and i never brought it due to the blu-ray player. To me the blu-ray player in the ps3 was a bit like a bonus that i recieved. I still believe blu-ray has one due to the fact that people think blu-ray is "cooler" than HD-DVD.

[Ayepecks]

I was referring to the PS3 launch. Hence, you know, including the word PS3 in that sentence. ;) Before PS3, HD movie sales across the board were basically nothing, which is the reason why BR took over in only a matter of weeks.

Also, this is a good idea:

"Speaking of doing what's right for consumers, we have an idea. Warner and the rest of the Blu-ray Disc Association should take the high road in the weeks ahead, and offer some kind of deal to HD-DVD enthusiasts as a nice gesture. It could be some kind of arrangement that allows them to exchange a couple of their HD-DVD movies for Blu-ray versions of the same title, or some kind discount on Blu-ray hardware and software. Think of it as a peace offering - a way to welcome HD-DVD consumers into the Blu-ray fold. It's just a thought we had, but we think it's something the BDA should seriously consider, to help put all this format war foolishness - and the acrimony it's inspired online - behind us."

http://www.thedigitalbits.com/index.html#mytwocents

I'm kind of wondering if Toshiba and Sony aren't going to come to an arrangement that will somehow allow HD DVD playback in Blu-Ray players, as to the best of my knowledge the technology is there on most players. I doubt it'll happen because of all the hurdles, but just something to throw out there.

[Joel]

I was referring to the PS3 launch. Hence, you know, including the word PS3 in that sentence. ;) Before PS3, HD movie sales across the board were basically nothing, which is the reason why BR took over in only a matter of weeks.

I missed the PS3 part of your post, you're right. But as dead as HD-DVD was, so was BD.

And the PS3 was still more expensive at the time than HD-DVD players were, but it was a much cheaper option for BD for sure. The allure of the PS3 now is the speed of its load times for films and the fact it's conceivably upgradeable to profile 2.0 through firmware updates. If money allows for it, I may have to get one as a player. I would have hoped that BD players would have dropped in price more than the PS3, though, sine you are getting a games console also.

[AlphaPrime]

I'm kind of wondering if Toshiba and Sony aren't going to come to an arrangement that will somehow allow HD DVD playback in Blu-Ray players, as to the best of my knowledge the technology is there on most players. I doubt it'll happen because of all the hurdles, but just something to throw out there.

Maybe Toshiba will bring out some dual-format players. It'll be interesting to see what they decide to do.

I missed the PS3 part of your post, you're right.

Well without PS3, BD wouldn't have a chance of winning, everyone knows this really. The 20GB was around the same price as the HD-DVD players at that time, and more produced as well.

[Ayepecks]

I doubt it. If Toshiba is going to bargain with Sony, they're either going to cave in and go Blu-Ray or they're not going to work with them at all. It'd be counterproductive to their cause to make dual-format players if it was obvious they felt HD DVD couldn't survive.

[mattmatik]

Toshiba should bring out a dual-format player and lead the charge. Make it affordable and it will sell. Regardless of what people say, consumers did buy HD-DVDs and this would be a great way for Toshiba to save face and still profit. If Sony refuses to make BD cheaper, Toshiba can get in there and still make some noise.

I still refuse to buy a PS3, though, even after this. Why? Because it tells Sony it's okay to force a format. Maybe Microsoft will come out with a BD add-on now.

[AlphaPrime]

Well the HD-DVD support in their BR players would just be there so that people who own their format can still use the discs. It's useless if it makes the player cost too much though.

[Green_Eye]

When I first heard of this I honestly didn't know what I felt was more pathetic, the fact that the consumer is losing out horribly or the way "certain" members were calling out Boz... :no:

Honestly it's just sad...

[Smigit]

And they can't do anything regarding games because Microsoft tried to save a buck by not including an HD player by default, they can't all of a sudden start making HDDVD games, alienating the majority of its users.

Actually interesting point. I wonder where the market would have swung had MS gone HD-DVD and the cost hadn't caused the hardware to rise too much. Surely HD-DVD would have had the advantage since it was the PS3 that really bolstered the BluRay sales and that took an extra year to arrive.

Anyway it looks to me like the wars likely over soon. I'm happy. The format I wanted to win looks like it will loose (HD-DVD) but in the end of the day I'd much rather there was one format sooner than not being able to even adopt a player because films I want are on both formats. Had dual players hit an affordable price then it wouldn't matter, but atm it looks like things will be in Blu Rays favour soon enough. Hell, maybe now I'll end up with a PS3.

As for prices, I still think they will go down. They have DVD to compete with along with the many manufacturers who will be selling HD players. As for HD-DVD's cost advantage. Yes the hardware cost were nice, but at least locally the media still cost the same amount so frankly the cost of a player is not that big an issue when the media itself is still expensive. The HD-DVD drives still cost $500AU upwards too for the base models which here makes the PS3 a better buy in my opinion. So it's only in some regions where HD-DVD has a price advantage anyway, here in Australia I'd be hard pressed to say either was offering particularly good value.

[Ayepecks]

Well the HD-DVD support in their BR players would just be there so that people who own their format can still use the discs. It's useless if it makes the player cost too much though.

I get what you're saying, but my point is that Sony bargaining with Toshiba would allow Toshiba to make Blu-Ray players, and it would allow both to update the firmware to support HD DVD (if it's possible), which Toshiba would kill off (the format), so HD DVDs weren't still being created, but old HD DVDs would be playable. By doing this, it'd be a "good faith" gesture by the companies so that HD DVDs aren't useless.

[Huleboeren]

...

I still refuse to buy a PS3, though, even after this. Why? Because it tells Sony it's okay to force a format. Maybe Microsoft will come out with a BD add-on now.

But MS is forcing DVD on you!

OH

MY

GOD

:o

[Chsoriano]

Toshiba should bring out a dual-format player and lead the charge. Make it affordable and it will sell. Regardless of what people say, consumers did buy HD-DVDs and this would be a great way for Toshiba to save face and still profit. If Sony refuses to make BD cheaper, Toshiba can get in there and still make some noise.

I still refuse to buy a PS3, though, even after this. Why? Because it tells Sony it's okay to force a format. Maybe Microsoft will come out with a BD add-on now.

I've actually already sent an e-mail to all of the contacts at Toshiba I could find... suggesting they urgently work to produce a dual-format player and/or provide a sort of "replacement" path for the thousands of families who purchased an hd-dvd player this holiday season. That is, if they're going to throw in the towel.

[AlphaPrime]

I get what you're saying, but my point is that Sony bargaining with Toshiba would allow Toshiba to make Blu-Ray players, and it would allow both to update the firmware to support HD DVD (if it's possible)

Not possible though. A Blu-ray player can't play HD-DVDs with just a firmware update. It would need extra hardware to work, pushing up the price, basically making it a dual-format player.

[MGS4-SS]

The best format won in the end regardless of what things were done for it to happen.

[Tech Star]

I'm kind of wondering if Toshiba and Sony aren't going to come to an arrangement that will somehow allow HD DVD playback in Blu-Ray players, as to the best of my knowledge the technology is there on most players. I doubt it'll happen because of all the hurdles, but just something to throw out there.

Maybe they will, who knows, Sony already works with Toshiba for the cell.

[mrchetsteadman]

It's like saying that a vintage Dodge Challenger that sells for $100,000 at an auction is not worth it because you can go to a dealership and pay $29,999 for a new one. :blink:

:laugh:

That's a GREAT anology!!

im still baffled by the decision... i realize HD DVD didnt have better sales and all, but from a cost standpoint... HD DVD is cheaper. i just dont get why people want to pay MORE for a very similar product.

Better marketing.

i aint over till the fat lady sings ;)