How to use a TV tuner without a set-top box/digital transport adapter?

[Guest kevinmd88]

Presently I have a Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-1800 TV tuner installed in my HTPC. With the insanity that is the "digital switch" being in full effect in the US at this point, I also currently have a Digital Transport Adapter (from Comcast) in my room; I was told this is necessary to "convert" the analog signal that comes into my house to a digital signal such that my TV (or in my case TV tuner) can receive all the channels available. Before I got the DTA, I noticed that once the digital switch day came, some channels would come through and others wouldn't. The lineups seemed screwy too.

But anyway, my setup is working okay at the moment; I have an IR blaster setup between the tuner and the DTA, and all the channels come through.

Today I tried to see if I could eliminate the need for a DTA or STB entirely - I was reading the manual for my tuner card and it mentioned that one of its coax connections is for Digital TV. However, taking the DTA out and just hooking the cable outlet directly to that jack didn't work. I assume this is because the signal that comes through the wall is still analog until it gets to the STB - thus the difference between the "digital switch" and the actual "digital cable" service they offer.

But the problem I'm facing is the analog connection on the TV tuner itself does not work either for this scenario (without the digital transport adapter thing). I get some channels but again the lineups are screwy and most of the channels don't come through.

My question is, what is the DTA doing to the cable signal that my TV tuner card can't/isn't? Are there any tuner cards out there that will eliminate the need for a DTA or set-top box?

[giantpotato]

I think you are confused about the "digital switch". The switch from analog affects Over-The-Air signals that you would pick up with an antenna for free. If you hook up an antenna to the digital coax connection on your TV Tuner Card you should be able to pick up these channels.

I'm not sure what a DTA is, but I assume it's a Digital STB like the ones from other cable companies. Basically it just takes the encrypted digital signal from the wall and decrypts it so you can view the channels you pay for. If the box uses a CableCARD your only other option would be to buy a TV Tuner capable of accepting a CableCARD to decrypt the signal.

Also, some cable broadcasters might broadcast some unencrypted digital QAM channels which can be picked with your tv tuner, but you will not be able to pick up the encrypted ones.

[Guest kevinmd88]

Thanks for the reply. I figured I was somewhat confused with it all, so I just spoke with Comcast's tech support, they told me that the signal that actually comes in from the line outdoors to my house is analog, and stays that way until it gets to the DTA (Digital Transport Adapter - basically a set top box that doesn't have on demand, guides, etc.) - once it reaches that point the signal is THEN "converted" to digital so that all the channels come through properly to my tuner.

I also asked them if that was the difference between my current plan and the "digital cable" package they offer - they confirmed to me that the actual Digital Cable plan they have is the one that has a digital signal all the way through instead of analog up to the DTA.

I'm not sure what you mean by hooking up an "antenna" to the digital coax connection, but anyway I figured I would give it a try: I connected the coax cable from the wall directly to the TV tuner (I tried both jacks just to be sure - they say "ANT IN" and "TV IN" on the card itself)... With "ANT IN" I get about 25 channels (and strange to me is that they're 6.1, 17.2, and the like o_O) but about half of these don't come through properly. Some of them *appear* to be HD, and a lot of them seem to be variations of each other... I also tried "TV IN" and I had the same problem I had before I put in the DTA - most of the channels *appear* but most of those say "Programming Unavailable" or something, and the lineups don't seem to match up with the actual channels.

So I guess I still have some curiosities about my original question - are there any TV tuners out there that will "function like my DTA" in that I can hook directly up to whatever TV tuner can do this, and it will "convert" the analog signal to digital so I can receive all the channels in my plan (I don't have the actual "digital cable" with the 1000 channels or whatever) but without the need for a set-top box or the DTA I currently have?

[shihchiun]

No. If you can't watch it on your TV without a cable box, you won't be able to use the feed with a tuner card.

[giantpotato]

I just did a little research about Comcasts DTA and it's not a standard Digital Cable STB like I thought it was. It is the opposite of what you say it is. The signal from the wall is digital and the DTA converts the digital signal into analog to use on analog TV's/analog Tuners. You should be able to directly connect the wire from the wall to your Tuner since it's digital. You might have to run a channel scan with your tv tuner software to get the proper channel numbers since digital transmissions have the actual channel they are broadcast on and 'fake' channel numbers which are usually associated with the old analog channel.

[Tatiania]

I have the hauppage WinTV-HVR-2250, the "big brother" to the hauppage 1800. The only difference is my card has two analog and two digital tuners. On both cards digital only refers to QAM and ATSC, with ATSC being a digital capable antenna and QAM being the free digital channels that are piggy-backed with the analog channels that are brought into your house on your coax cable. Also, neither card actually decrypts channels like HBO, Showtime, ect. You will only recieve the free digital QAM and ATSC channels. And for ATSC you have to have a digital antenna, a regular one(i.e "rabbit ears") won't work.

I have Time Warners basic cable plan and with my old analog tv tuner card I got the standard channels 2 through 74. With my new hauppage 2250, I get the same analog channels as before, but now I also get 84 QAM digital channels. What software are you using with your tv tuner card? I ask because the hauppage tuner software is ok, but if you want something that is gonna give you a proper EPG and PVR functionality you should use something like Snapstreams Beyond TV. I've tried alot of different PVR software like Vista and Win 7's media center, ATI's multimedia center and hauppage's WinTV 7. None of them even come close to Beyond TV's capabilities.

Tatiania

BTW, I used to have the 1800, so I know it works great with Beyond TV and recieves QAM and analog channels just fine. The only reason I upgraded to the 2250 was because of the 4 tuner advantage. I can record any combination of 2 channels while watching a 3rd.

[+BudMan MVC]

"And for ATSC you have to have a digital antenna, a regular one(i.e "rabbit ears") won't work. "

Complete and Utter FUD - Nonsense, Gibberish, etc.?? "Rabbit Ears" work just fine...

http://www.hdtvinfoport.com/TV-Antenna.html

Although they may be labeled: "TV-Antenna", "Digital TV-Antenna" or "HDTV Antenna" - the consumer should not be misled. A TV-Antenna that can receive traditional Analog TV Signals, is NOT different than an Antenna that receives Digital-HDTV Signals. Manufacturers and Retailers are merely taking advantage of the current, heightened Consumer interest in all things related to Digital-HDTV. However, a TV-Antenna does not discriminate between Analog TV and Digital / HDTV Signals.

If looking the type of antenna to make the most the OTA Channels in your area -- this is a good website.

http://www.antennaweb.org

Think about it for 2 seconds... Digital TV is still broadcast over the VHF and UHF bands just like Analog did.. So the same VHS, UHF antennas you used to get your analog broadcast still work to get the now digital broadcast ;)

Ie your old school typical rabbit ear set top antenna will work.

I would suggest you check out antenna web for the best type of antenna design for your area for the channels you want.. But you can still use those rabbit ears you have laying around.

[Tatiania]

"And for ATSC you have to have a digital antenna, a regular one(i.e "rabbit ears") won't work. "

Complete and Utter FUD - Nonsense, Gibberish, etc.?? "Rabbit Ears" work just fine...

http://www.hdtvinfoport.com/TV-Antenna.html

Although they may be labeled: "TV-Antenna", "Digital TV-Antenna" or "HDTV Antenna" - the consumer should not be misled. A TV-Antenna that can receive traditional Analog TV Signals, is NOT different than an Antenna that receives Digital-HDTV Signals. Manufacturers and Retailers are merely taking advantage of the current, heightened Consumer interest in all things related to Digital-HDTV. However, a TV-Antenna does not discriminate between Analog TV and Digital / HDTV Signals.

If looking the type of antenna to make the most the OTA Channels in your area -- this is a good website.

http://www.antennaweb.org

Think about it for 2 seconds... Digital TV is still broadcast over the VHF and UHF bands just like Analog did.. So the same VHS, UHF antennas you used to get your analog broadcast still work to get the now digital broadcast ;)

Ie your old school typical rabbit ear set top antenna will work.

I would suggest you check out antenna web for the best type of antenna design for your area for the channels you want.. But you can still use those rabbit ears you have laying around.

Sorry, my mistake :blush: although several of my nurses have changed to "digital" antennae and have noticed an improvement over there old antennae.

But, isn't it true that certain designs do work better than traditional? Also, I can't remember the sites at the moment, but there are some sites where you can put your address in and they can give you the best direction to aim your outdoor antenna for best reception. Or will I get an ass-chewing for that too, BudMan?

Tatiania

[shihchiun]

^ The site you're looking for is AntennaWeb.org

[+BudMan MVC]

Which I clearly linked too in my ass-chewing ;)

If looking the type of antenna to make the most the OTA Channels in your area -- this is a good website.

http://www.antennaweb.org

I never said that a different style of antenna could not give you better reception.. And clearly linked to where you can find the best type of antenna for your location and channels in your area, etc.

But whatever antenna style you pick will be designed for the frequencies of the broadcast, not if its analog or digital ;)