Why are MMO's, MMO-like?

[treemonster]

I was not talking about any particular game when I mentioned wind, I do not know of any off hand that work this way, but it honestly will not surprise me if they start doing that soon, they seem to be trying to make them more realistic, even if it's less fun. Though in Modern Warfare there was a sniping mission that had wind affect the bullet, but it was only a specific area so it was probably scripted instead of actual wind. Though gravity affects bullets in BF2, and many other of the realistic-styled games it seems. As for bullets passing through objects, that was just an example of progress from Quake and UT, it could certainly be done better (bullets damage scale from velocity, and have different materials that slow bullets by a certain velocity, instead of either bullets penetrate something or they don't).

That comes down to your computers performance though, I get constant FPS without a problem in most FPS games I play, what I was talking about (and what you were talking about earlier) was latency, which has nothing to do with FPS. I guess your argument is changing from crappy netcode to bad optimization in general, which is different, and does seem to be a major problem in most modern games on release.

duken nukem had gravity affecting bullets in 1995.

i used the 7fps thing to measure relative effective performance, you were getting an actual 30+fps, but playing due to latency of dial up felt like 7fps. both hardware performance and latency spikes can have an affect on these games, and tbh game sin general seem to tak eless time to optimize in many case than the big games back in teh day for th emost part, though there are som notable examples of godawful at launch games even back then.

Did my own test last night if you want to compare numbers. A 15min round of TF2 with 16 or so people generated 15MB of traffic. 30min of running around Dal checking the AH and then an Isle PvP match generated a whopping 8MB. I'm still waiting to play a 256 man shooter though, or even an 80 man like AV. Tree must not have explained to them how this is easily possible with 1337 korean MMO netcode. Cause then my rockets would always find their target, even around corners!

dalaran is empty on every single wow server in every single region that has cata(ie everywhere but china). isle of conquest is mostly teams running by each other to get to the bosses.

does the bf games still have 64 or 128 man servers anymore btw? used to play on those all the time with my 5mb down internet on my amd 2400+ with a radeon 9200 without lag and complex bullet physics.

[Nagisan]

duken nukem had gravity affecting bullets in 1995.

I don't recall that, perhaps you are right, but the standard FPS did not make bullets projectiles so it was basically you hit whatever you were aimed at regardless of distance. It seems more and more games these days are going the realistic route and making the game more difficult, less fun, and worse to play in doing so.

[treemonster]

I don't recall that, perhaps you are right, but the standard FPS did not make bullets projectiles so it was basically you hit whatever you were aimed at regardless of distance. It seems more and more games these days are going the realistic route and making the game more difficult, less fun, and worse to play in doing so.

bf1942 you had to lead moving targets. most people were terrible at it so it was easy to rack up 30 kills with no deaths on a map in desert combat mod.

current fps blockbusters seems to be some kind fo weird mix of realism and arcade. there are some true military sims out there, that are very slow paced and tactical, but the for the most part it's jus this bizarre no idenentiy fps thing with mmo style grinding or w/e and other weird ****.

me being a cs snob that i am, i don';t think that game was really realsitic either, but it was less arcady that previous fps games. but to contrast to fire arms mod for hl1, which had broken legs from 3ft falls and hardcore pull up on smg's(when it got to that point all of that was the reason i switched from fa to cs- like you mention, it was no longer fun to play)

[Nagisan]

bf1942 you had to lead moving targets. most people were terrible at it so it was easy to rack up 30 kills with no deaths on a map in desert combat mod.

Are you sure that is due to projectile-based bullets though? I only played a small amount of bf1942, when a kid brought it into school (I had a CAD class which was super easy for me and a couple other students, so we spent free time playing games while others worked, we had a cool teacher though too), but I do know games like CS1.6 and other similar games, you had to lead your targets due to latency, not because of bullet travel times.

Actually, BF1942 used hitscan, not projectile bullets, so if you had to lead your target it was due to latency.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitscan

I know, wikipedia is a bad source to quote, but I'm sure if you searched for bf1942 hitscan you could find better sources on hitscan in bf1942.....I'm pretty sure someone wouldn't add it if there was any credible evidence against hitscan in BF1942.

[Dashel]

Did another test, ran around OG for 45 min between bank and AH, lots of people on. Same proportional results (I hit 10.5MB this time). Isle was everyone fighting at mid point as usual.

[treemonster]

Are you sure that is due to projectile-based bullets though? I only played a small amount of bf1942, when a kid brought it into school (I had a CAD class which was super easy for me and a couple other students, so we spent free time playing games while others worked, we had a cool teacher though too), but I do know games like CS1.6 and other similar games, you had to lead your targets due to latency, not because of bullet travel times.

Actually, BF1942 used hitscan, not projectile bullets, so if you had to lead your target it was due to latency.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitscan

I know, wikipedia is a bad source to quote, but I'm sure if you searched for bf1942 hitscan you could find better sources on hitscan in bf1942.....I'm pretty sure someone wouldn't add it if there was any credible evidence against hitscan in BF1942.

oh idunno what hte term for bf1942 bullet phsyics was. i just know that it was different to play from cs1.6(which i also played at the time) in that you had to lead off targets. that being said my ping in cs1.6 was less than 10ms at the time, where as in bf1942(DC) it was around 100.

compared to csss which still has the laggy hitboxes even with lower pings and you have to actually aim BEHIND players to hit them(though it's incosnsistent between servers- i've played from teh west coast on east coast servers with euros and not had it, but played fairly local servers and it's been just so bad)

i don't know alot of games that use pure bullets as objects. hl1 had rockets as objects in 1998, and it worked fairly well on 56k dial up in hldm. you could literally see the rocket nearly miss you pretty often. can't comment on any of the other weapons except for maybe the alien dart gun thing or the weapon that spawned a bunch of little bug things, but tbh no one ever used those in mp mode. the lazer gun was really good as it OHKOed on charged shot, and people used the gluon gun even though idk, it was just a weird gun to use and heavily affected by lag but the stream went around corners.

i played hldm again several years ago on broadband, and it was completely different game than i remembered from the late 90s. it was all about trick/skillshots with the lazer gun and nothing else with the double jump thing.